“I’m Always the Other Woman”
I feel as though with the admittedly MAJOR exception of them clearly cheating on their significant others, they have all been otherwise great guys. The current situation I’m in is with this really fun guy who works for a different branch of my company in a far away state. We travel a lot together for work and one night after some drinking he kissed me and we ended up sleeping together. Now, I would never come on to him or make the first move, but I was very willing to succumb to his — he’s hot, and we’d be having a great time together. After the first time, we basically continued our affair for the duration of our trip — it was a three-week long business trip. We still talk fairly frequently now that we’re both back to our real lives, but we have another month-long trip together coming up shortly.
I guess my question is two-fold: How do I talk myself out of continuing this sort-of relationship with the current guy, and what could possibly be the underlying reason that I keep letting this happen? I promise that I have been in other normal, healthy relationships in my life. This is just something I need to figure out. — No Will Power
Relationships are a lot of work. They’re time-consuming, and you have to make compromises and think about the other person. Relationships can be messy. And you don’t always get it right the first time, and unfortunately, when that happens, it can make for a lot of heartache, and heartache sucks. So, I can understand the temptation to stick with men who are unavailable for a real relationship. They seem easy, like a fast, no-hassle microwave meal or some greasy-but-delicious take-out. But when that’s all you’re surviving on, you lack the necessary nutrients to really thrive. And not only that, when you sleep with men who are committed to someone else, you are actively contributing to someone else’s eventual pain. That can’t feel good.
You’re better than that, aren’t you? Your body and soul deserve better, don’t they? So, brush off your cooking utensils, go searching for a few good recipes, buy some fresh, seasonal ingredients, and put away your take-out menus where you won’t be easily tempted. You may make some mistakes on your way to creating the perfect dish, but you’ll be better for it. And when you do finally make that perfect meal? All the mess and hassle that came before will be worth it. I promise.
Follow along on Facebook, and Instagram. If you have a relationship/dating question I can help answer, you can send me your letters at wendy(AT)dearwendy.com.
WTF? You are the kind of women who give faithful girls bad names. I’m not saying the guys here aren’t at fault, but clearly you are targeting taken men. Get your own (single) guy and lay off the ones who have someone waiting at home.
As the former victim of infidelity, this letter made me so mad.
Sorry for the rash remark. It was a little harsh. I just was so instantly disgusted.
My initial response was very much the same, but with far more profanity so I just opted to not say anything.
It doesn’t matter what Wendy said in her response. This woman will sleep with this man while she’s on the business trip with him. She’ll sleep with him until the guy ends the affair and she’ll find a new and taken man next.
Don’t you think that’s sort of harsh considering she is writing in to get advice on how to change?
i think you two are being unfair. yes, it is wrong to sleep with men who are in relationships. but obviously, as she wrote to wendy about this, she is trying to change something. secondly, it is the men’s responsibility to be faithful to their partner (and vice versa). it is not right to blame the LW for their actions.
who are you to judge that she can’t change something about herself? sometimes all you need is to hear those words from someone else to be able to follow the advice. again, i can only say that it is the men’s fault for cheating on their long-term partners, not the LW. it may not be the nicest thing to do, but its not like she knows/is friends with the women.
I actually slightly agree with you, but I recognize that my opinion on this is unpopular (i’ve had this discussion with other women before). Yes the LW is in the wrong in willingly sleeping with married/taken men. But then again, it takes two to erm…you know. The LW clearly knows that what she’s doing is wrong, even if it doesn’t bother her – she recognizes she probably shouldn’t be doing this. So I think that’s a good positive step. Honestly I think the LW probably has some deeper issues when it comes to men and relationships and may need counseling to find out what is at the root of it.
In the end you can’t make a man carry on an affair if he isn’t willing to do so. FYI, I don’t know if a lot of you have the same experiences I do, but a wedding ring on a man seems to be a serious aphrodisiac for women. My husband gets hit on so often, sometimes when I’m even with him. Does he go after these women? Of course not! But somehow I think that married men are a turn on for some women (and esp. college aged girls, god knows why). I mean sure, my hubby is a cutie pie, but he’s also in his 40s!
LOL! I just said something about how the married/committed folk seem to be magnets! I’m glad I’m not the only one who seems to have had this experience!
My husband and I both have that problem, but he is so oblivious (always has been) that I have to tell him when women hit on him. He was a drummer in a fairly popular local band and I found it amusing to watch girls swoon over him at the gigs and he was completely oblivious to the advances. When he and I started dating I had to be very very upfront and clear. It does seem married men (and women even – I have had a lot more advances since having a ring on my finger) are magnets!
I think it has to do with confidence – people in a relationship aren’t looking, so they aren’t always thinking about the possibilities with every person they meet. It’s easier to relax and be yourself, which most people find sexy.
I agree with you. The LW wrote an honest letter to Wendy asking for advice (and Wendy gave very good and very NICE advice), but she is going to be ripped a new one in the comments. Sad.
Here’s the thing, LW. A lot of women draw the attention of married/engaged men. My girlfriends & I have noticed that it seems like since we got married, we’ve found ourselves the objects of a lot of attention from single and married men. But we all recognize that we have vows to keep. Not only to keep, but to truly honor, so when we find ourselves in those situations that could be trouble, we learn to cool the jets immediately because we don’t want temptation to get the best of us.
You’ve got to learn to do that, LW. Although the onus is on him to be faithful, you know that these relationships are not good for you, not good for the man, and not good for the unsuspecting wife/fiancee. So stop. Take control & accept responsibility for yourself. You know when some mutual flirting is getting a little too hot & heavy. You know when you’re kissing him that you shouldn’t be doing it. So when it happens, take a deep breath, and remove yourself from the situation. If you feel too much pressure to say, “you’re married, this is cheating,” tell him you forgot that you had to call your mom to check in on her. Take a fake phone call. Tell him you’re on your period or feeling sick. Whatever it takes to GET OUT OF THERE.
I genuinely believe that once you’ve broken the cycle, it will be so much easier to simply nip these things in the bud before they cross into extra-flirty territory. Oh, and if you find that you’re missing the companionship or the intimacy, get a friend with benefits or something. If you’re getting your jollies somewhere else, it’ll be a lot easier not to succumb to the wiles of these taken men. Taking some time off from relationships altogether to get your bearings back is probably also not a bad idea.
You can do it, LW. Just say that you’re going to make a change, and do it. Because if you don’t, maybe it won’t be today, maybe not tomorrow either, but one day, you WILL get caught and it may be totally devastating.
I love this answer.
Great, non-judgmental advice! It’s hard to change bad habits, but it’ll be better in the end.
Well said! I particularly like that you said “take control and accept responsibility for yourself.”
This is easily the best comment. People are definitely in judgment mode with this article, but that’s not helpful. If I was in this situation, I think your comment is exactly what I would need to hear.
Excellent advice! Practical, nonjudgmental. If I could add one thing, I’d remind the LW that these guys (guys who cheat) will never end the affair on their own. If they’re okay starting an affair, they’re in no rush to end it. It’s solely up to you to end things. So be strong and stay out of his way when you see him!
How about just date a guy who is not in a relationship? Is it THAT difficult?
And the underlying reason sounds like you have no self esteem. You are ensuring that every “relationship” you have will never go anywhere other than a hotel room.
Yes, the men in the situation are wrong but that doesn’t make her actions any less horrifying. She is still in the wrong for willingly sleeping with attached men which is what the other posters are pointing out and because the letter was written by her and not the men she is bearing the brunt of the harsh comments.
Of course it doesn’t, but it doesn’t mean that she needs to be “slut shamed” either. I think there are deeper issues than she digs married men. It could come from her past. Whatever it is, she clearly wants help in fixing this. If it were just as easy as “stopping” then clearly she would. I think it’s probably a psychological thing. How many of us can say that we carry no scars or damage from the past, and that the past does not affect our future behavior? I know I can’t say that.
I mentioned in my comment below that I thought maybe there was something deeper going on (maybe self esteem or abandonment issues). I do think it is great that she is trying to be honest with herself and change things. I tried pretty hard not to “slut shame” her, but I think maybe some of the really tough comments are likely people who have been hurt by situations like this. But I definitely agree there is likely a psychological problem involved in this, which is why I encouraged LW to see professional counseling to help her deal with it and learn some coping tools.
I didn’t particularly mean you in slut shaming, I meant some of the other comments. I mean really, some of the responses are pretty harsh. Yes, she’s clearly doing something that’s wrong – but if she didn’t want to change things she wouldn’t have written in in the first place. Of course I don’t condone her behavior, but I also don’t think calling her out and castigating her while she’s seeking help is going to help her change her ways. If anything it might make her feel more isolated and drive her away from seeking help in the future.
I would understand if she didn’t know these men were taken until way into their “relationship” but she knew from the get go.
Idk call me “old fashion” but I would not be able to have a relationship with a man that was taken.
1) What future would I be fostering for myself knowing the man I am in love with is a dirty cheater that has not respect for commitment.
2) Him being a liar bastard is HIS cross to bear & I could NOT contribute to that.
I have no sympathy for the LW. One time is forgivable, but repeatedly? No, no, NO.
I agree! Once, I can see. But multiple times? Sorry, but her letter makes her sound like an idiot.
I wouldn’t want to work with her, either. It sounds like it could get uncomfortable for co-workers.
Definitely! Especially since one of the guys was ENGAGED!
I think that’s worse than being married. How can you be in love with someone that is already cheating on someone he’s just starting to “build a life” with.
That’s just sad…
I agree with anonymous. Let’s give this woman a chance! She wrote in asking for help to change something she doesn’t like in herself. We should all be encouraging her to step up and better herself! We as women need to support each other, not trash talk one another when someone is reaching out for help.
No, I don’t agree with the things she’s done, but out of all of us, who hasn’t done something they regret morally? Girl, listen to Wendy and put in the work it takes to be better. You’ll love yourself for it.
Wendy, thanks for being positive and not putting this LW down. I know from experience, sometimes people do not-so-nice things because they are hurting inside and they are lost, NOT because they are a bad person.
How do you change something that you dont like yourself doing? YOU STOP DOING IT. end of story.
I think that when you’re mature enough to see a pattern in your behavior, you’re mature enough to change it. All LW needs to do is say no. It’s as simple as that. When the opprotunity presents itself on this trip, all she has to do is say, “No, I’m going to go back to my room. ALONE” and it’s done. She can choose to not answer his calls, and to not fall into flirty emails with him.
And when she meets another guy who ends up being married/engaged/whatever, she can choose to say no to them too.
She really needs to do some soul searching to figure out why she’s attracted to these men, and really fix the problem inside. But until she’s really worked it out mentally, she really needs to actively choose not to do the things she’s doing.
Exactly!! As if there aren’t enough single men in this world.
It’s like women who go after a**holes & then complain that their men treat them like shit.
Get over it & change your behavior!
tsk tsk tsk…LW, I think Wendy is right that you are afraid to be in an actual relationship that might go somewhere rather then a relationship with a man you know will never leave his significant other (whether it be a wife, fiance, or girlfriend). You are the only one who can know the answer to why you are doing this. Commitment phobe? Low self-esteem? Who knows. The point is that you are actively contributing to hurting another woman. I honestly think you need therapy to get over this problem because no one should enjoy hurting other people over and over again. Or maybe you just need to be in a relationship and have a man cheat on you to know how it feels. Perhaps this is where the pattern started???
To quote Nene Leakes…Close your legs to married men!
I have had to rewrite this response multiple times because there is just so so much wrong with this letter. LW – please seek some professional help. You obviously have a really low sense of worth if you are willing to be with men who are not willing to be with you, because according to your letter none of these men have told you they are willing to leave their SOs for you. For the love of God, one got MARRIED instead of committing to you.
Also you cannot label what is going on with you and your co-worker a relationship because that would require you to spend time together outside of the bedroom. You are these men’s sex toy, their booty call, their little something on the side – you are not their girlfriend (they already have one).
If the emotional pain (both for you and for the girlfriends and wives) are not enough to convince you then at least think of your career. You are sleeping with a co-worker and many companies require all relationships to be disclosed to your boss and some companies outright ban interoffice romances. Even if there is no punitive actions against relationships, you probably will still be labeled the office harlot for sleeping with a guy in a committed relationship. The way people view you will be damaged and that could be reflected throughout your career progress.
Please LW, stop this destructive pattern. Look for someone who will love you, not someone who is willing to sleep with you when he can spare some time away from his SO.
“when you sleep with men who are committed to someone else, you are actively contributing to someone else’s eventual pain”
I agree with Wendy on this 100%. God, how would you feel if you were totally in love with someone and found out he had been cheating on you! Karma is a bitch, thats all I gotta say to this LW.
It’s very simple:
STOP DATING MEN THAT ARE TAKEN!!
end.
I definitely agree with Wendy that it seems like she’s trying to avoid a true relationship (though LW did say she has had real relationships that weren’t with taken men). I would advise seeking some kind of counseling because it seems like there is some kind of deeper issue here with self-esteem or abandonment or whatever. When I was younger, I was big on the “don’t let people get to close and don’t get too serious because then you can’t get hurt” idea. But that also means you will truly never have a meaningful relationship. You have to risk the pain, messiness, and heartbreak. Please, LW, seek professional counseling and try to get to the bottom of it. And in the meantime, just say NO. And stay out of situations that tend to lead to this behavior whenever possible.
I agree with people saying that in this case, the men are responsible for their relationships. If they choose to cheat, that decision has nothing to do with the LW. She just happens to be there at that particular moment. That being said, by now, she should be able to recognize the signs and avoid the situations that in the past have led her to make choices that she regrets. I mean if an attached guy is hitting on you and you find him attractive, and you tend to make bad decisions when you drink, then you probably should not drink in the company of that particular guy.
I believe that, generally, you attract people you want. You choose people you have relationships with. In my opinion, the LW is one choice conscious choice away from stopping this pattern of behavior.
Trash. Break it off with him and show some respect to the women you are screwing over. Yes, they make the decision to step out on their relationships, but you can make the decision to have some self respect and some compassion for their girlfriends, fiances, wives, and kids. Grow up.
Oh, girl. The fact that you wrote in for help with this gives me a lot of hope for you. My ex cheated on me and it about killed me, but I never really blamed the “other woman” (now, granted, I wouldn’t want to go have coffee with her or anything either) as much as I did him. Obviously it’s wrong and obviously you know that. And while you might have some underlying “issues” that are contributing to the fact that you’ve done this three times now, I think it’s more likely that it’s just a run of bad luck.
It’s really easy, when you’re dating around casually, to assume a sort of “I can do whatever I want” attitude about it. I know I have in the past. It’s easy to forget the big picture when you’re happy with someone…after all, you’re not cheating on anybody.
Only you are cheating yourself. Because every time that guy goes home and sleeps with his wife? Cheating on you. Every time that guy goes to his fiancee and tells her he loves her and can’t wait to marry her? Cheating on you. Every time the current guy flies out to visit his long-distance girlfriend, hugs and kisses her, has torrid, “I haven’t seen you in 2 months” sex with her? HE IS CHEATING ON YOU.
Going into a relationship knowing that he’s with someone else is wrong, by all accounts, but you already know that. So the next time you’re tempted, ask yourself why you would settle for half of a relationship? Why is he allowed to sleep with, live with, make love to other people when you’re not? You are worth so much more than that.
I would definitely try to get out of a month long business trip with someone you are having an affair with. It sounds like the LW can’t resist the temptation (neither can the guy), and if someone from her job finds out she could be fired depending on company policy.
I think it would depend on how large her company is. Also, try explaining why they’re in a different hotel on an expense report (which would mean carpooling?) is kind of difficult. Just say, “No, sorry. I met someone,” when he puts the moves on her.
Wendy, sometimes you amaze me with how nice you are.
Great answer Wendy!If just saying no was as easy as all these commenters seem to think, then I would have a sweet savings account (because I would just be saying no to shopping and eating out), I would never do anything I didn’t want to (because I would be able to just say no to people), and I would probably be much thinner (because I would be saying no to delicious and fattening food).
Changing habits is HARD! Especially when there are emotional and psychological issues that fuel them. LW needs support- hopefully she will be able to get it from someone who will get down off their high horse to assist her, instead of judging her from afar.
You have a responsibility too… Treat yourself better than this. Know that this is wrong and that you are fucking breaking someone’s heart and you don’t even feel guilty about it.
I’m sorry, but this really bothers me.
If you’re scared of a true relationship, then stop messing someone elses up.. I would think you’re only creating a pattern where this will come back to you, years down the road.. and you’ll wonder if your loving man is scewing someone else.
Also, seek help. I don’t understand how someone could not feel pain over this situation you’re in.
The LW recognizes her pattern of behavior as wrong, that much I admire.
But that doesn’t change how angry the letter made me. She knows its bad, but knowing it’s bad and CONTINUING to do it is not ok. It’s good she wants to change. But her letter wasn’t really that apologetic.
This is absolutely truly just my opinion, and I anticipate the purple thumbs, but LW doesn’t come across to me that she’s sorry for the possible hurt she’s caused other women. She seems more upset that she’s gotten the short end of the stick, so to speak. And that’s what upsets me about this letter. Not simply her actions, but the attitude she seems to have about them.
Having said that, I really hope that she makes a change and finds happiness with a guy who can be available to her, and Wendy’s advice was really great and non-judgmental.
Wendy, your response was far too kind. The letter writer asks why she continues to stay in this pattern. It’s because she says YES to men in relationships. All you have to do is start saying NO. Have some self-respect and will power. And put yourself in the shoes of the woman who’s being cheated on. Where is your morality?
I normally don’t love the ‘go to a therapist’ response, but it might be in order here only because we have an established pattern of behavior and it might be hard to break without some help.
Until then, we have the fairly immediate issue of the upcoming business trip. This is a problem since your previous trip turned into a Bangfest and you’ve remained on friendly terms with the guy, which means that (right or wrong) he will pretty much be expecting Bangfest II. We need an action plan:
1. Don’t drink at all. Just don’t. You have enough self-control issues without alcohol nudging you along.
2. No intimate contact at all. There is no ‘just kissing is OK’, or ‘so long as we don’t do THAT’, or ‘boobsex doesn’t really count’. Also be prepared for him to get completely pissed bordering on confrontational. You’re basically slapping his hand away from a previously open cookie jar and he’s going to get upset. Be prepared to shut this guy down right away.
3. Be prepared to come clean. If the guy forces the issues or at least tries to be really, really charming, remember that you hold the trump card here since he has a relationship on the line and you don’t. Threathen to report him to HR if you need to. I know it’s playing dirty, but you need some sense of control over the situation if you’re ever going to regain any kind of self-discipline. This is kind of a last resort. Like don’t go to step 3 if your pants are still on.
One thing I think you may be doing is not ‘closing yourself off’ to these men. When I was single, the second I found out a guy was in a relationship, he was off limits to me. Did not exist in my mind as a sexual being. (Now only my boyfriend is a sexual being). If you were giving off the vibes of being open, these guys picked up on it. We are all in control of what we send off as far as availability goes, and you need to figure out what is appropriate and what isn’t. Even entertaining the idea of kissing someone in a relationship: definitely inappropriate!
Women are really harsh on each other sometimes. I have an overly developed conscience about most things but in this case I think that while the LW actions were not ideal, the onus is on the man to maintain a faithful relationship with his partner. He is the one who is cheating and has every reason not to do so but proves himself to be not worthy of his partner/wife/girlfriend. I’m not saying that sleeping with a married man is okay, but it’s more that I feel sorry for her that she has been used by those guys. She’s let herself be used and that’s really sad. Every woman should know that they deserve someone of their very own, who will be with them all of the time, not only the time when he’s not with his real partner. If you’re with a guy who’s already taken then you know already he has a pretty big moral flaw which should be a deal-breaker if you have enough self-respect. Despite the general consensus I don’t think the guilt for these relationships is hers to carry round, but she needs to know she can do better if she gives herself a chance.
It’s like although I WANT to drive my car really really fast because it’s a huge buzz for a short while, I resist the temptation since I’ll run out of gas sooner, I know it’s really irresponsible and people (including me) are likely to get hurt. Take responsibility to do what you know is the right thing.
First off, I really like Wendy and GingerLaine’s advice to the LW. I just think I might have some food for thought/a little different perspective. When I was a teenager I used to have a similar tendency to go out with guys that had girlfriends. Yes, I had a lot of self-esteem issues, etc. (and for the record haven’t done anything like it in years). However, all the bitterness and slut-shaming and gossiping that I got from women (who I had NEVER done anything to) gave me very little reason to want to be better to them. It allowed me to build an idea in my head that the other, other woman, whatever you want to call her, really was some kind of terrible shrew. I am NOT saying that means anyone deserves to have their commitments flagrantly ignored, but maybe lets try not to be such bitches to each other in the process.
I work in an area of Los Angeles that is almost entirely young married men with nice cars and nice suits. There was a time that I was flattered by the elevator flirtations and hints that they wish they were single again, and I didn’t understand why women got so mad at married men that hit on them. Besides, if they aren’t getting any at home, so what if they like to have some harmless fun? It was just general flirtation, but today thinking about it, I realized that I took it as far as THEY wanted to, and had they been more active than suggestive I don’t know what a foolish girl with low self esteem like myself would have done. Luckily, before I got to find out, two of my good friends who were married decided to get divorced. The husband had been cheating on her for years and was leaving her for the latest in a long string of mistresses when the wife discovered the affair. Seeing her, watching her heart break and that catastrophe wreck everything that she had been working for in life made me angry in a way I never experienced before. What’s more was that this male friend constantly complained how unhappy they were to me and his other friends and our constant urges to get counseling or even a divorce fell on deaf ears, he wanted to cheat, he didn’t want to do the kind thing. Now, I understand the anger women have when married men hit on them. I understand how much married men are willing to destroy with their partner just so they can feel turned on and attractive.
LW, my advice to you is this: Fake it. Fake the anger when married men come on to you. Every time you reject them, you will understand more and more that they were only using you to fix what was wrong in their life, not as an actual person they’re interested in. What if you are sick or injured, and have to go to the hospital, will this man be able to come and support you? What if a relative dies, will this man be able to come to the funeral and be with you while you grieve? No. And what’s more, he’s glad. You’re not a partner to him, and he’s glad to have the break from having to care about another person. You like being the thing they wished they had, I get it, but once you remove yourself from this pattern you will understand that you are only the girl that they know they can bullsh*t for sex.
I used to feel that the “other woman” took too much heat. I couldn’t understand why the cheated seem to lash out at a perfect stranger as much or more than the person with whom they had been intimate. After all, the other women wasn’t the one who broke promises and lied directly to a loved one’s face. She was certainly wrong to ride in the get-away- car but she was not the one committing the murder.
Now that I’ve been married for awhile my perspective has changed. I still believe that partners are completely responsible for keeping their vows through good times and bad. But now that my husband and I have lived through some tumultuous times (the deaths of family members, buying a house, changing careers, having kids) I can fully appreciate how vulnerable a marriage (or relationship) can become. Sometimes two people are trying the best they can to share a life. Sometimes needs aren’t aways being met, and people aren’t always happy and connected to each other. It can take time for a relationship to bend, adapt, and accommodate as people grow. Such times can last weeks or months or even longer. They can be filled with anxiety, depression, resentment, and terrible gut-wrenching loneliness. Thankfully, I have seen how a marriage can come out of these times stronger and more resilient than ever before. But people in relationships can be really vulnerable during the growing pains over the course of their life.
Although I have never cheated on anyone, my reasons are far more substantial and ingrained now than they used to be. I don’t think the LW is getting in these situations because she wants something easy. This may be the case with the last guy, but surely not the guy she was in love with. I think LW simply does not see it as that wrong. She says these guys have “great character” with one exception. Clearly she does not value commitment, honesty, or emotional integrity within personal relationships as necessary prerequisites to character. Maybe she does not believe monogamy is realistic. She could think she isn’t hurting anything that isn’t already broken. Maybe she feels it isn’t her responsibility to care about another women. Maybe her self esteem is low and she thinks she better take love and affection where she can get it. Whatever the reasons are on some level she knows that her belief system is dysfunctional and destructive or she would not be writing to Wendy.
IMHO if the LW wants to change her pattern she is going to have to do some serious introspection. If she can’t figure out the reasons herself, counseling would probably help. If she wants to avoid getting involved again on this next trip she needs to find some other satisfying distraction during the times when she with this guy. She needs to have other things to do and think about besides engaging him.
Sorry this was so long, I guess I got carried away.
The way to break your cycle is empathy. It stops you from contributing to others’ pain. It prevents you from being taken advantage of.
You’re planning a wedding and your fiance is so excited to share the rest of his life with you. He proudly shows off your ring to all his friends and talks to you about buying your first house together, although you guys don’t have enough for a down payment yet. But you can dream.
You’re so tired from working long hours and taking care of your two kids, but seeing them with their father makes you smile. Sometimes he gets up early to make you pancakes on Saturdays so you can have a break. Sometimes he arranges for the ‘rents to take care of the kids so you can have a date night.
You wake up early to call your boyfriend every day and sometimes you cry because you miss him so much. You scrape money up for a cross-country flight because all you want is to hold him. He sends you love letters in the mail because he’s a romantic.
I don’t care if he seems so nice–there’s someone out there who loves them and has no idea he doesn’t. That makes someone more unattractive than anything else I could possibly imagine.
The scary thing, and maybe why you’ve fallen into a habit of unavailable men, is that once you’re in a committed relationship, you ARE them. These guys that are, by your words, so great aren’t great enough to love and honor their own. That is scary. But it’s not the truth. There are wonderful men out there who are honest. I hope with a bit of soul-searching you can realize that and get the best that you deserve as well.
I’m trying very hard to have sympathy for this LW, but she just has such a bad attitude. I feel bad that she thinks so little of herself she believes that these men are what she deserves but knowingly sleeping with a married/taken man is just wrong. I’ve always defended the other woman: it’s the taken person’s responsibility to be faithful, maybe she didn’t know, maybe the man took advantage of her, etc. In this case it just seems like the fact that they’re taken is a minor issue when in fact it should be the biggest, and only issue. You don’t sleep with a taken man, it’s wrong, you hurt people, and you’ll never get what you want from the relationship (unless all you want is empty, immoral sex). My father cheated on my mother with our babysitter multiple times before she finally left him. The other woman obviously knew he was taken but didn’t care and he was a worthless jerk that he didn’t care either. It caused a huge rift in our family so that I haven’t seen or talked to him and his side of the family in over 20 years. Do you really want to be the cause of that? It’s his responsiblity to remain faithful but that doesn’t mean you don’t have the responsibility to not sleep with him. There are definitely some underlying issues at play and I hope you find the courage to get to a good therapist who can help you. Not only does the innocent spouse deserve better YOU deserve better. You are not this man’s sex toy, you are a human being with real feelings who deserves a real relationship with a man that isn’t going to screw you then go home and cuddle with the wife. You deserve a man who comes home to you. You have to actively work to change this. Stop making excuses and take the steps. Avoid this coworker as much as possible and if he tries to come on to you remind him that he’s taken and walk away. It’s not going to be easy, breaking a habit that is tied up in our psychological issues is hard but if you truly want to change you can.
What the LW is doing is clearly wrong. And despite this sentence: “The problem is that it doesn’t bother me that much” (*chills*), her further explanation plus the fact that she is writing to Wendy convince me that she wants to change.
This is always an unpopular opinion when I express it in real life, but I personally think that the people who are actively committed to someone else deserve more, but not all, of the blame in affairs like these. They’re the ones who committed to someone else, who have made promises, and who are making decisions to break those promises. Don’t get me wrong, going for taken people is wrong and I’d never do that. But, it always makes me uncomfortable when people focus *all* of their energy on the whorey other woman (or man), and not the whorey person who couldn’t keep their genitals in check even knowing they were hurting someone who loved them, and who they supposedly love. To me, that takes just a bit more selfishness than jumping someone’s bones that you know has a theoretical significant other that you’ve never met. And, I think as Wendy hinted at, there’s usually some sort of issue they are wrestling with if they are doing that kind of thing regularly. She’s asking for help to change and that should be supported.
LW, take responsibility for the extreme hurt you are potentially causing to many people by your actions. If you can imagine some woman at home sobbing and heartbroken, and not be bothered “that much”, something is seriously wrong in your thought process.
I really agree with Lexington about making these guys off-limits to you and yourself off-limits to them. You may have to play a few mind games with yourself: Like, every time I would feel a little too flirty with a taken guy friend, I would imagine the dumb, blissful, bovine look on his face as his girlfriend gave him a BJ or something. I would imagine his bad posture and the hairs around his nipples. It might sound mean-spirited, but it helps remove the allure and make this mysterious, unavailable man just another guy. You know how dirty talk taken out of context isn’t sexy, just stupid and silly? You have to kind of make the guy less sexy to you—you can do that by imagining him sleeping with his GF, which could sting you a little, thus killing your arousal as the emphasis is off your body and onto your emotions and the risk you would be taking if you got with him. You can picture his daily private habits that are silly or gross, like picking his nose or cleaning his ears or asking his wife to pop the pimples on his back.
The point is, the above comments are right to say that, ultimately, you have to stop, you have to say no, and you have to resist the urge to pity yourself—don’t get hung up on how hard it is to stop—think strategically and creatively and maybe you’ll outsmart yourself.
I really agree with Lexington about making these guys off-limits to you and yourself off-limits to them. You may have to play a few mind games with yourself: Like, every time I would feel a little too flirty with a taken guy friend, I would imagine the dumb, blissful, bovine look on his face as his girlfriend gave him a BJ or something. I would imagine his bad posture and the hairs around his nipples. It might sound mean-spirited, but it helps remove the allure and make this mysterious, unavailable man just another guy. You know how dirty talk taken out of context isn’t sexy, just stupid and silly? You have to kind of make the guy less sexy to you—you can do that by imagining him sleeping with his GF, which could sting you a little, thus killing your arousal as the emphasis is off your body and onto your emotions and the risk you would be taking if you got with him. You can picture his daily private habits that are silly or gross, like picking his nose or cleaning his ears or asking his wife to pop the pimples on his back.
The point is, the above comments are right to say that, ultimately, you have to stop, you have to say no, and you have to resist the urge to pity yourself—don’t get hung up on how hard it is to stop—think strategically and creatively and maybe you’ll outsmart yourself.
This is obviously a relationship pattern that the LW needs to break. It seems to me that she is getting in relationships with these guys hoping they would chose her over their SO’s. I’m talking about the engaged guy that broke her heart.
Why do you set yourself up for disappointment? None of these guys chose you in the end. Why are you content with what they’re willing to give you – crumbs of a relationship? You should want more, and you deserve more. And stop thinking that if they prefer you NOW, they will end up preferring you forever.
This is something I noticed about myself (as in, it happened, and I realized it did a long time after) – whenever I meet a guy and I find out he’s in a relationship, my mind instantly considers him asexual. As in, I’m not attracted to him, ever (even after the end of his relationship). So try to imagine that all guys in relationships are dickless (sorry for that mental image, Spaceboy).
Also think about consequences on your future relationships. Will you be able to trust a guy when he’s away from you for 2-3 weeks? Given your own behavior, you probably wouldn’t care that much anyway… And if you don’t care, how meaningful is that relationship?
I agree with everyone else here, you need to figure out the root of your problem.
I think alot of the readers are missing the point. It isn’t who is to blame when someone cheats because each relationship is different. Everyone I know who is the other woman more than once is doing it to prove something. You are proving that you a better than the woman at home or that you can get the forbidden fruit. The fact is, you shouldn’t engage these guys in the beginning. It is hard to say know when sparks have been flying all night. Why were you at that bar in the first place? These things just don’t happen. You are making decisions to put yourself in these situations time and again. It isn’t that you are attracting these guys, you are pursuing them.
It is like they say, if you are driving on the road and get rear-ended that it is the other driver’s fault. But if that same accident happens to you multiple times, the blame on some part lies with you.
While it’s hard to find for a lot of people, myself included, to feeling sympathy for the LW, I truly pity her. I had a friend exactly like the LW. She would throw herself at guys with girlfriends, fiances, wives, etc- and seemed to always ponder out loud how unavailable, attached guys ALWAYS found their way to her. There is a reason LW, why these men are the only type you attract, you broadcast (even unconsciously) that you are the type of woman who would be okay with such trysts (as you state it “doesn’t bother you much). If you did it once, these things to happen, but there’s a pattern here and the only common thread is you.
I highly suggest seeking therapy. This is clearly a cry for help of some deep insecurity or issue you have with others. And my friend that was so much like you? Well that story doesn’t have a happy ending so far. She got involved with multiple friends boyfriends, alienated her friends which was her only support group, got pregnant with a man who had a girlfriend, that man of course never left his girlfriend, got fired from a job because she hooked up with her boss (at a company his wife OWNED! Sheesh), and she’s alone and still miserable. Granted she’s an extreme case, but would you want to end up like that? Pull it together. This is not an alcohol problem we are taking about here, it’s a learning to love yourself and respect other people’s relationships issue. Look at yourself in the mirror EVERYDAY and tell yourself that you’re worth more and chasing these attached men is only putting bad karma into the world and refuse to be a part of it. Once you truly love yourself and respect others relationships, I highly doubt you will be this unknowing beacon for attached men.
I’m not going to bash you, because I truly believe you lack self-awareness on this issue, but I do think you’re reckless and insecure. And maybe you lack empathy or the foresight to understand the repercussions of your actions. I suggest therapy, because it won’t go away until you get to the root of the problem.
Listen, the men here are at fault, too, and I assume you validate your behavior by telling yourself that they’re unhappy in their relationships and that they would cheat no matter what. That it’s not your problem. But this would not happen three times if you weren’t actively doing something to push them into cheating. I’m guessing you instantly perk up when you discover a man is in a serious relationship, whereas I think most of us immediately back off.
Do you simply want what you can’t have? Is it a game? Or are you so insecure that you need to feel wanted by someone unattainable? Do you need to prove to yourself that no man can turn you down? Maybe you have some sort of romantic fantasy about a man falling in love and leaving his wife for you, or you are so scared of commitment that you put yourself in relationships that are destined for failure. I don’t know what it is, but the pattern is only going to continue because you don’t seem to take relationships and peoples feelings seriously.
Something needs to change, because as it stands you’re eating greasy burgers at McDonald’s every day and that is simply not sustainable.
i think if it was easy to stop, she would do it as easily as some here have said she could… i think she may be addicited to the thrill of it. but in the end, it will only hurt her. kinda like a drug, like any addiction really. its fun in the moment but the consequences are damaging to you and your left with nothing in the end. its great she recognizes she has a problem. she needs to remove herself from temptation, keep busy with new activities/friends and believe she is worth more and all the while envision in her mind what she really wants in the future. if she sets these goals for herself and sticks to them she should be fine. good luck, you alone can put yourself first.
I’m not one to judge, kiddo. I’ve done some really stupid stuff with some men who really weren’t worth my time. For whatever reason, you don’t want to be in a relationship. Not a real one, anyway. Maybe you’re not ready, maybe you feel like you don’t deserve it, maybe you only want what you can’t have. I don’t know – only you know the answer. I had a pattern for years of falling for, and more importantly, staying with, emotionally unavailable men. I eventually figured out it was a defensive thing. Men who didn’t really love me were safer because if I knew the ending, I couldn’t get hurt. But then I realized I was hurting regardless, and all I was doing was ensuring I was coming up empty-handed every time. And that was a stupid thing to do for someone as smart as I am. So get to the bottom of why, and then you face your solution head-on.
And stop saying you don’t have a real problem with sleeping with unavailable men. If you don’t, why’d you write Wendy? Maybe you’re not racked with guilt, but if it’s a coping mechanism or a self-esteem issue, then what you’re doing – in your eyes – is just what you’re doing to yourself.
How do you not do it? Well, you make the decision not to do it. Your explaining your last tryst with this guy as if it were done to you or you were watching it, which speaks volumes. You were an active participant, so become an active non-participant. Tell him if he wants to wreck his relationship, that’s his thing, but you will not actively participate in it. Don’t see him outside work hours. If you must, don’t be alone with him. If you must be alone with him – as in, required for your job – then don’t enter a hotel room alone with him. You have to think about it ahead of time to prevent it from happening spontaneously. And if you don’t want to do that, it’s totally your decision, but then own up to the fact that you’re self-sabotaging and morally questionable.
I think that Wendy’s got the reason down. It’s easy to go for guys who aren’t available and can’t make a commitment because then you can’t get hurt but even there you did get hurt.
To quit you quit. You draw a moral line and you never cross it. You hold yourself to a standard that you can respect and that others will respect. These men that you’ve had affairs with certainly don’t respect you. Most likely they’re using you for a good time and when you’re no longer providing enough fun or difference from their spouse they’ll move on to the next woman.
The other thing you have to realize is that these guys are not top choices when it comes to men. They obviously are lying to their spouses about what they are doing and if their spouse can’t trust them you obviously can’t either. A lying sneak is not a top quality guy. If you want happiness you choose quality and toss out the moldy, rotten stinky ones.
So, hold yourself accountable for your own actions and hold partners accountable for their actions.
I’m not going to repeat what everybody else has already said (and so eloquently, too) but I will say this: LW, no matter what relationship you are in, be it normal or with an unavailable man, always, ALWAYS use birth control. FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, at least protect yourself in that way!
Imagine that you’re sleeping with a married man and you get knocked up. That child will destroy a marriage if the wife and family finds out. I don’t know about you, but if I was married, and my husband got another woman pregnant, you’d better believe he’d be out of the house faster than I can say “asshole.”
Please think. Not only about this, but also about why you’re so willing to let married or unavailable men take advantage of you. About why you’re okay with contributing to the deterioration of another relationship. Because you are, even if the girlfriend or the wife finds out. When he’s done with you, the man will just go and find someone else. Once a cheater, always a cheater. Maybe it’s not always true, but there is a reason why people say it. Just sayin’.
Man…to me sleeping with taken men (as a pattern!) because you don’t want to invest in your own real relationship is quite a bit more reprehensible than ordering food because you don’t like to cook. There is nothing morally wrong with wasting money on ordering unhealthy takeout. Based on Wendy’s harsher reactions to other LWs, I was surprised by how easy she went on this one, who clearly needs to develop a personal conscience. The problem with this letter is that she is seeking advice for “talking herself out of” something that she should find disgust with herself for, but treats like a bad habit.
“The problem is that it doesn’t bother me that much.”–She lost my respect at sentence #2.
As much as I disagree with some opinions, I really enjoy letters like this because it really gives you a chance to see so many other perspectives on things.
The Dear Wendy Community rocks. (:
Even though this is getting incredibly long, I’d like to add one thing that is bothering me: “For whatever reason, I seem to draw the attention of men who are either married or in serious relationships.”
ALL women draw the attention of men who are married or in serious relationships. How many of us haven’t gotten stares, or flirted with, or full-on propositioned by someone in a committed relationship? The LW’s tone suggests that drawing the attention of men in relationships is something that is unique to her, and that mysteriously “simply can’t be helped.” By saying that, she absolves herself of taking responsibility for her actions, which isn’t right.
This happens to all of us, but not all of us act on it. There’s a big difference, and I hope the LW understands that.
All I can think about are those poor girfriends, fiance’s and wives. Its heartbreaking to hear that those men run around like that, and think nothing of it.
People really dissapoint me sometimes! 🙁
I would never be able to cheat on someone…even if you have no more feelings for them, you should realize that and have at least an ounce of decency as a human being to get out of the relationship, and let both of you move on.
These men are using you, LW. Not just for sex. Each one has selected you to be the blunt object to bludgeon his SO’ s soul to death. Don’t you deserve NOT to be the Candlestick in the Library?
It’s the dude’s fault for hitting on you, sleeping with you, dating you, etc. It is. But for five seconds, consider the wives and girlfriends. Maybe you told yourself they’re b*tches, or they’re cold, or they don’t please their men. Maybe you even tell yourself they “deserve” this, since the guy is obviously not happy. And maybe some of that is true, but no man or woman ever deserves to be betrayed.
You can’t stop these men from cheating on their SOs with other people, but you can stop them from cheating with you. Take a step back, consider why you’re attracted to these men and what you’re getting out of these relationships, and pinpoint it. Is it healthy? Probably not. So let it go–let THEM go–and don’t help to hurt another woman.
You can choose to be the better person in these situations.
LW: Even though there are quite a few harsh (and even downright mean) comments on here I do hope you are able to sort through whatever problems you may have in these scenarios.
Unfortunately, not everyone can be in a monogomous relationship and some people tend to wander (such as these guys you fall for). BUT! that being said, it’s up to YOU to make a change. You said that it keeps happening to you and in one instance you continued to sleep with a man after discovering he was with someone else. That’s your own fault. Not his. Not anyone else’s. If you don’t want to be with these guys THEN DON’T. It really is that simple.
I’m sorry to say it but it sounds like you’re on your own here. You need to figure yourself out and stop being The Other Woman. No one can make you stop other than yourself.
P.S. It really isn’t fair to the other women in these relationships, which hopefully you consider. Nor is it fair to yourself if you truly do feel sorry.
I saw a study a few months ago about people who cheat on their spouses. The study found that those who had greater empathy didn’t cheat and those who had lesser empathy were more willing to cheat. Even though it was a study of spouses who cheat I think the same idea probably applies to you. You have less empathy so you don’t feel the pain of the spouse being cheated on so you don’t care. Most of those replying to your letter feel that pain even though they know nothing about the cheated on spouse except that she exists and that is enough to make them feel her pain and thus respond to you in a negative manner. The very thought of fooling around with a married man turns my stomach. I could never cheat on my husband because I could never hurt him in that way. Since you don’t mind hurting people you’re probably low on empathy.
What is wrong with people? I know they “say” you cant help you fall in love with, but with all due respect I dont agree with that at all! You want to know all about him from the jump so you can make sure you’re not with some freakish person that kills people on the side just for kicks,and I know another thing you want to know is if he/ she is married. as soon as you find this info out and you realize they are married then that should be the second you call it off! With millions and billions of single people in the world why would you want to be the person that breaks up a marriage? Good or bad.
You wont get the best of that person until they can “find” themselves again,
I will never understand how a person can sleep at night knowing 100% that what they are doing to a family is totally wrong.
Call me old fashion but at least wait for the ink to dry on the papers!
“The problem is that it doesn’t bother me that much.”
Make it bother you so much, that the very thought of sleeping with someone in a relationship will make you throw up.
(I was once in a bar, and a guy started to hit on me. As soon as I saw the wedding ring on his finger, I asked him where his wife is. He said – at home. I wanted to punch him! He’s out at the bar, having fun, hitting on other women, and his wife is at home? What a jerk! I stopped talking to him afterwards, obviously.)
When I found out that my ex started dating someone else, even though we have been separated for about 6 months by that time (he wasn’t cheating), it felt like a kick in the stomach, and I lost my appetite for a couple of days. He was the only guy I slept with for the previous decade. Imagine what my physical reaction would have been before the separation… That’s what probably SO’s of the guys you slept with will feel if they ever find out about you. Do you like being the source of that pain? Does the pleasure you derive from sleeping with those guys is worth the mental anguish?
The underlying reason you keep doing this: You don’t really think it’s wrong. You are okay with the idea of breaking up a guy’s relationship and having him go with you instead, unless there are children involved. You don’t think a guy who would do this is bad.
I’m not sure why you think this way. You want the guys to go with you, so it’s not that you have liberal ideas about sex and open relationships. Perhaps you have very romantic ideas about love and think that if a guy wants sex/romance with you, he can’t really love his wife/girlfriend and their relationship can’t be that great. People can love two people. Sex is a very strong force that can make people think they love someone they don’t, especially compared to real life where you have to deal with things like conflicts over the toothpaste, the responsibilities of parenting, money problems, irritating in-laws, etc.
Will it help you to tell yourself that the guy in the long-term relationship is probably attracted to you partly because he isn’t getting enough sex? That if his girlfriend were around, he wouldn’t bother with you?
I’m not sure how to get yourself to stop, but I think you have to get past the idea that a guy only cheats because there’s something really wrong with his relationship. People cheat for many, complex reasons and it doesn’t mean they love you or will want to be with you.
I think you should also consider the possibility that while you think these guys are nice except for the cheating, they may think you are not a good future mate because you are willing to cheat with them.
Have ANY of you ever been the other woman? I am guessing not from your responses. You have no idea what being in that situation is like. Love is not always right it does not always make sense. And sometimes it’s just plain wrong. You get into the situation of being the other woman it is one of the hardest things to get out of. Believe me. Don’t judge a book by it’s cover you do not know her.
I am in this position currently…..if anything honestly I’m worse than this girl. And I get where you all are coming from but the thing is this isn’t a easy fix. Many times we have been through a lot to get to this point. And this is almost like a drug. Sometimes you can’t say no, you can’t stop. And you feel guilty after every time. We are out there, and we are afraid of love, men recognize this because we are the easiest victims to stay silent in affairs. It takes 2, and unfortunately women usually get the full blame, but you have no clue what she has been through.
I can relate to this women completely. I have been in long term relationships and was cheated on every time. These days I’m sleeping with taken men but when I think about being in a committed relationship again, I think about all these men who are cheating on their partners and no longer believe that men can be faithful, so why bother with a commitment? These people getting angry, the men are cheating too and is usually them that pursues the women and yes we’re not nuns sex is natural and men that I’ve been with they told they’ve been with other women too… stop blaming the woman , it takes two to tango…and anyway if they’re cheating they’re not getting all their needs met or they’re bored….
I also would like to add that I’m now in my forties and enjoying sex more now than when I was younger.
Women love sex too. It feels good. Women aren’t always looking for a mate.
Some of us also enjoy casual sex! Omg!
Yes it’s true, believe me it’s great .
I came across this page by asking google why I’m always the other girl. I have only actually been the other girl once, a long time ago, and felt so bad about it that I broke it off and vowed I’d never do it again. I also cheated on my first boyfriend and broke up with him shortly after. I never told him I had cheated and I don’t think he found out but the cheating made me realise I didn’t want to be with him.
That was 13 years ago, now I’m 34, still single and trying to date and feeling so frustrated that all the guys I seem to have an initial connection with turn out to be not single! Not only that, but they seem to assume that I’m ok with that so I have to explicitly state that I’m not. I hear myself saying “I am NOT doing that” or “I am NOT touching you because you’re married” etc. Last time I asked the guy, “if I was your daughter would you want me to do this? Didn’t think so.”
I’m just feeling frustrated and sad that all these guys think so little of me and assume I have time and emotion to waste on a “relationship” that will go nowhere. I just wonder if it’s a reflection of the way I feel about myself and I’m trying to change it because I know I deserve better. Anyway that’s why I came across this page. Good luck everyone
Unpopular opinion here, but it takes 2 to have an affair. So cheated on spouses should direct their energy towards their spouse and not the other person. Mainly b/c it is your spouse that made the choice to cheat on you. To the other affair partner you are just an abstract. Also, please stop making comments that allude to the 1950’s trope of the “hot secretary”. Trust, most single women are not setting a giant man trap for your husband…. the only difference between them and you is the ring on your hand. We are all still women so the theme of “other-izing” “mistresses makes me queasy. Really? Lets all fight over men so it can be like middle school all over again. One major drawback to affairs is getting caught which negates all the pleasure from the hot tryst. So all in all, not worth it.