“My Wife Can’t Remember If She Cheated On Me”

My wife, “Jill,” and I got married early, while still in college. Because we were young, we had growing pains. It was not fun, but we managed to work things out over the years and have had a very good marriage for many years since. However, there was one thing that occurred within the first two years of our marriage.

Jill had dropped out of school, but I was still working hard on my degree. She came home from work one day and announced that she was going out with the girls from work. I knew from stories she had told me that at least one of the workmates played around on her husband. Another was an unmarried slut who had sex with every guy she went out with. I asked her where they were going, and Jill was very evasive and said that that was to be decided when they met at the house of one of the girls. She then started getting ready to go. She grabbed a black one-piece jumpsuit, which she had worn many times before but always with a blouse underneath. It only had two shoulder straps and was low-cut with double breasted brass buttons.

After she put it on, one could readily see down the front. I asked her to put a safety pin at the top to provide a little better coverage. She initially argued that I was being ridiculous, but then she acquiesced and pinned it where it was somewhat acceptable. Then she rushed out to her car saying that she would probably be late. Now this was unlike her in that she never went out with the girls after work, so I was a little suspicious — especially given the outfit she had chosen.

As she rushed away in our car, I jumped in my car and followed at a distance. She eventually pulled into an apartment parking lot. I pulled over to where I was not visible, but I could see the apartment parking lot and apartment house well. There were a lot of people coming and going from one apartment. My wife parked, got out, and began to walk up to the “party apartment.” When she was about halfway there, two guys came out with a girl to greet her. I recognized the girl as the unmarried slut from Jill’s office. I could tell that she was being introduced to the guys.

After the introductions, one guy put his arm around Jill and escorted her into the apartment with the slut and her date tagging along. Then I saw my wife’s date come out and grab two beers and go back into the apartment. I could faintly make out that she and the guy were seated on a sofa opposite the front door drinking the beers. I thought long and hard about what I should do. I thought about going into the apartment, confronting her, and dragging her home. Then I thought, “Is she going to have sex with the guy? If so, maybe I should give them time to get involved and go in and catch her in the act.” That seemed like a plan that would really put her in her place.

So I drove off with the expectation of returning in an hour or so. As I drove, my thoughts became more convoluted. I had not been a great husband, and maybe I deserved this. I had never cheated, but I was less than attentive to her needs and didn’t show her the appreciation she deserved. By the time I returned to the apartment, her car was still there, but the apartment door was shut. I didn’t really know what to do. So I just drove home with my tail between my legs.

The next five or so hours were agonizing. I just sat on the sofa in our trailer house waiting for her to come home. Finally, about 1:00 a.m., I heard the car. I decided to just sit on the couch like nothing was unusual and when she came in, I would ask about where she had gone “with the girls.” I heard one car door shut, but a few seconds later I heard a second car door shut. I was confused about the second door shutting. Then there was a knock at the trailer door. I got up and answered it.

Jill was standing there weaving back and forth in total drunkenness. She couldn’t even get up the steps to the door. I pulled her into the trailer just as I heard another car door slam and an engine rev up to take off. I ran past my wife, and saw two guys in a car heading very fast away from our place. I came back into the trailer. My very drunk wife threw her arms around my shoulders, started to cry, and said, “I am so sorry.”

She smelled of alcohol, and I had never seen her so drunk. The pin at the top of her jumpsuit was missing and several top buttons were undone, which exposed more than a little cleavage. I pulled her arms off my shoulders, and said, “You really need to get to bed.” I guided her weaving body back to the bed and left her there. I said, “We’ll talk about this tomorrow.” She didn’t say anything as she passed out then and there.

The next day at school, I had a test and had to be at school early. By the time I got home from class, she had gone to work. Later that day when she came home, we never discussed what had transpired. I don’t know why – maybe I was afraid to know and she was afraid to tell me – but the previous night was never discussed. And up until two days’ ago, it had never been brought up.

Jill has always suspected that I had sex with another girl that I had a date with while my wife and I were engaged. Truth is that I didn’t have sex with that girl, but I probably would have had someone not interrupted the proceedings. But the fact is that I didn’t have sex with her. Apparently, this has always bothered my wife, and she periodically brings it up and accuses me of it. It bothers me that I periodically get accused of something that never took place.

So this time, I said to my wife, “I have something that I have never told you.” Then I explained to her what I just wrote in the above paragraphs. She looked inquiringly at me, and said, “I don’t remember anything like that.” She claimed that she didn’t even remember the slut girl. I attempted to recall for her who the girl was, but she claimed that she couldn’t remember any of my story about the occurrence. She then said, “Did you check me when I came in? I might have been raped.” I said that as loose as she was that night with all the booze in her, that I doubted that a guy would have had to rape her. She probably would have been a willing participant. I don’t think she liked that comment, but she didn’t argue it.

She went on to say that maybe her top buttons were undone because she had to pee and was too drunk to button them back. That is possible, but it was the top buttons only, and she had to unbutton all of them to get out of the jumpsuit to use the bathroom. So it is doubtful that only the top ones by themselves would be undone. My wife then said, “I am sorry, but I don’t remember any of this or what happened.” Well, I’m sorry, but unless a person has cheated a godly number of times, I think there would be some recollection of at least the early portion of the evening before the booze took its full effect

Now, I will add to this. We’ll fast forward many years later (about two years ago). Jill and I have never been hard swingers, but there have been a few times over the years where we have done a little soft swinging, like fondling with another person. It never went further than fondling above the waist and never any hard swinging. Well, we were visiting this couple that we had done some soft swinging with before. We had dinner and then went out to their hot tub. We had been drinking very heavily and were more than drunk, and when we went back into the house, we all stayed naked.

The two wives started kissing and making out together. It sort of turned me on and the other husband as well. We went up and started kissing and fondling them. We didn’t necessarily pay attention only to our wives. Pretty soon I was doing some things that I should not have been doing, and so was my wife, but I didn’t have sex with the other man’s wife. Although we were all in the same room, I could not clearly see what my wife was doing.

After spending the night there, I was talking with the other guy the next day, and he said that he had had sexual intercourse with my wife. He even told me about a move she made, which is her classic move. As we were departing that day, my wife asked,”Did you have a good time?” I replied that I had. She then said that she never wanted to do that again. I agreed that we would not. I then asked her what she had done. She claimed that it was only what I had done.

I waited for about a week for her to come forward and tell me what she had truly done. She never did. So this time I confronted her, and I told her what her gentleman friend had said. She looked amazed. She said, “I just didn’t know I did that. I don’t think I did, but maybe I was so drunk, I don’t remember.” Well, I was just as drunk, too, and I know what I did and didn’t do. I have not broached the subject anymore with her, although from time to time she will bring it up and say, “I just really don’t know.” So now she is saying, “I just don’t remember about the date many years ago. Maybe I had sex and maybe I didn’t. It is just like that thing two years ago.”

I don’t think I believe her that she fails to remember these two instances. I think she feels guilty and doesn’t want to say and doesn’t want to remember. I can handle her having sex with another guy, but being untruthful about it is running me nuts. I just think she should be honest with me and tell me what happened. I think after all these years, she owes me that. Honesty is essential in any relationship. Any suggestions as to how I can get her to be truthful and honest with me on these things? — Untrusting Husband

You don’t even try to hide your misogyny, do you? From calling grown women “girls,” to repeatedly using the “slut” slur to refer to your wife’s former colleague, to insinuating there was a car in your relationship that belonged to you both and one that belonged just to you (implying that your wife literally has less ownership in your marriage than you do), to not worrying about whether your wife had been raped because you think being too drunk to know what’s going on is blanket consent for men to take advantage, to controlling what and how your wife dresses, to arguing that your being stopped from cheating somehow cancels your intention to cheat and makes you innocent while your wife potentially having sex while too drunk to consent IS cheating, to failing to understand that alcohol often affects women differently than it affects men (because of the typical difference in our physical sizes).

You’re a misogynist. And I’m not going to give you suggestions on how to get your wife to be truthful and honest with you. I’m not going to validate your concerns that she hasn’t been truthful and honest, based only on the misogynist lens through which you’ve viewed her and your marriage. What I’m going to do instead is suggest that the two of you go to therapy together and address your communication problems, your lack of respect for your wife, setting and clarifying boundaries (like what the rules are when it comes to your swinging, for example), and how your misogyny has affected your marriage. Good luck!

***************Follow along on Facebook,  and Instagram. If you have a relationship/dating question I can help answer, you can send me your letters at wendy(AT)dearwendy.com.


    1. Wow, you are a jaded woman I can see! This man is laying out a pattern of behavior by his wife who uses the excuse that she was “too drunk” to remember what happened to deflect any responsibility for her actions. We all know that’s not the case and she would have some memory of events at some point in the night. This man has very valid concerns and is just wanting honesty from his wife which she refuses to give him. She thinks it will hurt him to badly and possibly end the marriage so she continues to withhold information and honesty. What women don’t understand is that honesty is respect to men. When we know that we are being lied to, that tells us that the woman has no respect for her husband. My suggestion would be for him to determine if he wants to continue to put up with this behavior, because it is her go to when she wants to cheat. I have heard this excuse over and over again with women and that doesn’t t mean I don’t believe there are legitimate concerns and definitely cases of rape. That being said, both these instances, based on what has been shared, is not. She has shown no remorse, no true anxiety or concern about potentially being raped and would stop putting herself in that situation if this is the outcome each time. We are adults and regardless of being drunk, we are still responsible for our choices. My concern is with the first outing that was clearly planned and she knew that there would be other men there so she dressed up a sexy as possible to garner attention and the opportunity to engage in adultery. She knows exactly what she did and men and woman both will use the I was too drunk, or I don’t remember excuse, to detract from their actions and not take personal responsibility. He gave her every opportunity to be truthful and she hasn’t. As far as the slut comments, it sounds like he knows this women well and if she is promiscuous, then the label, however on fair it maybe, is a simple reality from a male perspective, just as you call men pigs, misogynists or whatever term you feel they fit, we do the same. Men can have boundaries, just as women do. A man that loves his wife will absolutely want to know where she is going, who she will be with and have concerns about his wife’s attire for the exact instance they fear, rape or worse. We can’t protect our wives when they go out with their friends if we aren’t there, so we want to have an idea of where to go if needed and we also want to safeguard them from other men aggressively pursuing them, because the reality is, the attire a woman wears will dictate how men approach her and see her. Unfortunately, if she dresses provocatively, men (pigs in this case) will assume she is open for sex potentially, considered easy and they will pursue her aggressively, while trying to get her drunk to lower her inhibitions and decision making abilities. In my opinion if she does not change her behavior, if he doesn’t communicate with her more about his concerns and trust issues, then they will have a miserable marriage and this will continue. The whole swinging thing is just a disaster waiting to happen and rarely will end well, especially involving people you know and see regularly. Sex creates bonds and emotions between partners whether we want to admit it or not, even when they go in strictly for physical gratification only. Pair bonding is real and making connections can happen when we least expect it. I personally think this marriage is in trouble and his wife and even him, are both looking for something, and also missing something in their marriage. Next time maybe be a little more understanding when it comes to going at a person who is clearly hurting and looking for answers. He may have not worded things perfectly, but he was by no means a misogynist. He loves his wife and wants to make it work, but wants honesty and respect. He is emotionally charged and has some animosity, which is why some choice words were used. Not all men are pigs, misogynists, rapists and narcissistic idiots, so don’t lump all men and assume off of one email that they are.

      1. “What women don’t understand is that honesty is respect to men”

        You don’t say?! Wow men really are special and unique creatures. *eye roll*

  1. I literally had to stop reading when he referred to his wife’s co-worker as a “slut” and then minutely described the outfit his wife was wearing. His letter just seethes with disdain for all women including his wife.

    1. allathian says:

      Yeah, he lost me there too. I literally feel sick and very sorry for his wife who has such an asshole dickhead for a husband. I hope she sees sense and divorces him ASAP.

  2. A Simple Narwhal says:

    My alarm bells started going off at “unmarried slut” and I completely checked out when he started describing his wife’s outfit. Great response from Wendy, though I am doubtful there is enough therapy in the world to make this man see the light.

  3. Bittergaymark says:

    Yeah, that entire letter was pretty awful. Just awful. And endlessly so. Yikes. Just yikes!!

    LW, you are simply a relic from a rather lousy past. It’s hard to generate much sympathy for some one who endlessly victimizes himself for his wife‘s possible rape. Although I think this rape is largely made up (by you!) and thus just some incredibly sick fantasy of yours… Your entire letter reads like a TROLL to me. Carefully crafted to ensure maximum outrage. Yawn.

  4. LisforLeslie says:

    Oh, the reference to the co-workers as sluts made me see where this is going.

    LW – I think you’re vile. You clearly don’t understand consent. You also don’t seem to trust in your wife, not because of her own actions but because of your own behavior and your opinion of what makes a woman good or not good. She owes you nothing. You told her about your would-have-happened-unless-someone-disturbed-you cheating ( which doesn’t speak a lot for your own faithfulness ) ONLY because you needed to know if she had cheated on you. You didn’t tell her your truth because she needed to know or because you wanted to clear the air. You told her because you had a motive and wanted tit for tat.

    Just go away.

  5. BGM is back!

    Wendy’s answer is perfect. I would only say that he needs intensive therapy ALONE to even TRY to undo his misogyny. Yiiiiiiikes.

  6. This is disgusting. Whether or not it’s some sick fantasy the LW made up, he’s disgusting.

  7. anonymousse says:

    The part that really disgusted me (the entire letter!) was when he believes his wife couldn’t be raped while drunk because she was loose? And her outfit. WOW.

    I hope this is a troll because men like this don’t deserve women in their lives at all. What a fuckhead.

  8. Something is off with this letter. It reads like a penthouse forum letter. This guy’s kink is cuckolding and he wrote a story about it. None of it sounds real.

    1. Bittergaymark says:

      Helen: struck me that way, too. It’s very Penthouse forum in style, tone, and content.

      1. Yeah, I’ve read enough bad erotica to know it when I see it lol

    2. Avatar photo Moneypenny says:

      Oh yeah, this totally reads like somebody’s bad creative writing exercise. Too much detail (brass buttons? ok.), and just the overall tone makes me think it was posted on Reddit at some point.

      1. Double-breasted brass buttons.

        When I Google parts of this, nothing comes up, but it does read like something some gross individual would write as a little story.

      2. The brass button thing was bothering me too. Like you remember the buttons if this was “Years ago”

    3. Yep. I vote poor imitation of a Penthouse forum letter too. Got to the careful description of her outfit from years ago and yelled “Fake!” Very few men of my acquaintance could describe what I wore yesterday in the kind of detail. And a jumpsuit isn’t the easiest thing to have sex in… whatever. He’s an ass.

      1. golfer.gal says:

        My god I hope you are all right and this is fake. Even if it is, the person writing it needs some serious help. The abusive behavior, controlling tendencies, and deep misogyny are really concerning. It’s sickening to read.

      2. LisforLeslie says:

        I can see it now – I was angry-reading after calling everyone sluts. the “I saw her through the open door and went home tail between my legs for being a meanie” is as cliched as it comes.

  9. Avatar photo veritek33 says:

    Oh gosh I have no words. I couldn’t get past the multiple uses of “slut” and “loose.”

    You sound like a terrible person and a terrible husband. I bet you’re a Trump voter too.


  10. The part that got me was him saying that he thought about catching his wife doing whatever he thought she was doing and dragging her home.

    I’m really struggling to believe that this is real and not from an MRA’s fever dream.

  11. katmich15 says:

    Hope those of you who think this is fake are right, I made the mistake of reading this while eating lunch, feeling sick now . . .

  12. ele4phant says:

    This was so long, I did not read it all.

    Your wife maybe cheated on you years ago and you can’t get over it? I need a tl:dr.

    That said, you seem very controlling (you don’t get to tell a woman what to wear, following her is creepy af) and judgemental of women’s sexuality, despite you yourself being into “soft swinging” and getting to cop feels on strange women.

    Worry less about your wife and more about examining your own attitudes about women and how you are supposed to treat other adults.

    1. The TL;DR is:
      “Women who do not behave in a way that I approve of are sluts. I think my wife may be a slut because she once behaved in a way that I did not approve of. Women who get raped deserve it and are also sluts. I, however, can behave however I want and no-one can judge me.”

      It’s a horrible, misogynistic letter.

    2. I want to educate all you woman about what a man is actually thinking and feeling when we voice concern over our wife’s attire when they go out to clubs, bars or parties with their girlfriends. We know men and most men are POS. When an attractive woman goes to this places, dressed sexy or provocatively, we know that other men will approach her, try and buy her drinks, attempt to get her drunk, aggressively pursue her sexually and take advantage the of the situation. We can not be there to protect or help her in the event this happens or god forbid she is drugged. We are helpless to save her and we stay up worrying the entire night, at least I do and did. To be quite honest me and my wife have agreed we will not do those things without each other because they are single people activities and places mostly. My wife had a terrible night and was assaulted by a man she thought was her friend who did just what I described above. We have boundaries and concerns for our wives, at least good men do, and we want to reduce the possibility of bad things happening. You think it’s controlling, to us we want to protect because we know the nature of men who are single and at a club, bar or party. As far as the slut comment, it might be an unfair label but if there is a single woman that is with your wife or if she is the only one married, I have seen it time and time again where they encourage bad behavior and actively push the married woman to “have fun” and don’t worry no one will know. It’s usually because they aren’t true friends for one, are envious of her marriage or are to drunk to make the right decisions. He called her a slut because he’s angry and blames her for what happened, so cut him a break. He is upset and hurting. He maybe a POS as well, we don’t know truly, but he asked for a woman’s point of view and this is what he got. Hopefully I have given some perspective on this. I will also add rape is horrific and I believe men who are convicted should serve 20 year’s minimum in prison. I also believe that we need to let the process play out, because there are instances where false accusations are made that destroy lives. If that was even a thought that night or the next day, she should have been in the police station filing a report, because you only create more victims if you don’t report these scum. I know it’s difficult and I won’t pretend to know or imagine how it could feel, but these animals need to pay if they truly rape a woman. It’s all terrible and alcohol is truly a substance that perpetuates the cycle of infidelity, bad decisions and potentially deadly mistakes, we all have to be responsible and protect ourselves the best we can and have someone with us to help. I just wanted to provide a little perspective because a good man will always be concerned and it’s not controlling in many situations and I know there are insecure controlling men so I’m not condoning that.

      1. Oh just shut up, honestly.

  13. what everyone else said, plus- just because YOU can remember exactly what happened to you when you were drunk doesn’t mean your wife can. We are all different. I have a friend who always forgets huge chunks of time if she gets even a bit tipsy. Anyway, you say you don’t care what she did, just that she won’t tell you. She probably can’t tell you. And why should she? You were in an openish relationship and you assert that you don’t care what you did, you just want her to admit it (when she doesn’t really know. So actually was probably in no condition to consent. ). Why? So you can badger and torture her about it? So you can forget about it? If the latter, assume the worst (you are anyway) and just move on. If the former, have a talk to yourself about why you want to treat her like that.And see if you can get some therapy.

  14. I don’t get why you wanted your wife to have sex with another man so you could “catch them”. Agree this sounds made-up. I don’t think my husband could tell you what any of my buttons were made of.

  15. Just as an aside, I don’t believe that ~double-breasted~ buttons on a jumpsuit would be functional and not decorative. I think they’d just be sewn on and you’d pull the top right down or unzip the side instead of unbuttoning it.

    Also, who honestly wears a BLOUSE under a jumpsuit anyway? What kind of look is that?

    And finally, I don’t remember jumpsuits being in fashion until fairly recently, and this sounds like it happened years ago. This one I’m less sure of. It could be they were in 20 years ago and I just didn’t like them so I didn’t have any.

    But yeah, what manufacturer would make you have to unbutton 4-6 brass buttons to take a piss?!

    1. It sounds very much like an 80s jumpsuit to me which I guess could make sense if this was real and set ages ago.

      1. Still don’t think they’d make you unbutton a whole double breasted situation.

    2. “It only had two shoulder straps …”
      As opposed to eight or ten. ?

      1. ??????

  16. This guy spends way too much time in his own sick head, making up drama to feel better about himself.

  17. Whether it’s real or not, I need a shower after reading it. Ew.

  18. I am really surprised you would give a platform to this, even to refute it.

    1. Elena, I get so many letters like these and rarely post them. I debated posting this one, but given the current moment that we’re in, culturally and politically, and given that this letter is actually far tamer than most I get from misogynists, it felt ok to post this, if for no other reason that to add some fuel and extra motivation to fight for our rights and our dignity while we still have an opportunity to do so successfully. This kind of misogyny exists, it is woven into the fabric of our society and it greatly impacts policies and laws and cultural expectations in a way that affects all of us. While I have no intention of highlighting and giving platform to this kind of misogyny on a regular basis – this site is almost 10 years old and I can count on one hand the number of times I’ve posted a similar kind of letter – I think there are certain instances when doing so makes sense, and on the day a Supreme Court justice was confirmed who will threaten women’s rights to autonomy of their own bodies and in the middle of an election in which many more of the rights we have fought so hard for are at risk, it seems like an appropriate time to give a not-so-subtle reminder what we’re up against.

      1. A reply from the LW (i.e. what we’re up against):

        Well, Wendy, I guess you told me off. And perhaps I deserved to be told off. Certainly if one takes a poll of the other letters that commented on the post, I am the closest thing to slime that ever existed. However, I think that there are several factors about which you and the commentors were unaware that could and should be explained.

        Firstly, the almost affair that I had when engaged to my future wife was a one night thing, and I was tremendously drunk – as was the girl. Although I had planned at the moment to have sex with her, it did not happen. I felt very guilty about it, and my wife never knew a thing about it until just prior to our marriage, I felt that I owed it to her to admit my guilt before we tied the knot. I believed that it was the honest thing to do, and I didn’t want any dishonesty to exist at the very beginning of our marriage. Was I wrong to have almost done the deed? Yes. But I did come clean about before our marriage. Maybe I would have been better off not to mention it, but that would have been almost as dishonest as the act itself. In addition, since that time, I have never had an affair with anyone. I am certain that you are aware that 50-60% of married men in the U.S. have had an affair during their marriages. So am I any worse than those 60%? I think not, although it is all wrong.

        In regard to calling the girlfriend of my wife a slut, that was uncalled for and a mistake. I am of a different generation than you most likely are, and that word was not considered to be as derogatory as it is today. Probably a more apt description for her was that she was a nymphomaniac, because she had sexual intercourse with every guy that took her out according to my wife’s description of her. And I do know that was true of any of our friends that took her out. I apologize for labeling her as I did. And I recognize that nymphomania is a mental disease, and labeling a person with the disease with a derogatory term is unjustified.

        In regard to the consent issue with my wife and possible intercourse while intoxicated, you are correct that it should be considered rape. At the same time, if I had been the only one totally drunk with that woman I took out (assuming she was sober), would you consider my indiscretion to be rape by the woman, provided the act was completed? Or is it just a one-way street? I do know that women tend to get more inebriated than men given the same quantity of alcohol, but I also know my wife’s capabilities to drink a relatively large amount of alcohol. Her weight is about 165 to 170 pounds. That is relatively close to my weight, and she can consume close to the same amount of alcohol and will attain the approximate same level of drunkenness. I do believe that there may have been a high degree of guilt in her stepping out on me that night, and as a result, she may have consumed more alcohol than normal to cover that guilt. So you and she are probably correct, in that she may have been taken advantage of by that guy, and that is rape. I was wrong to discount that fact. Thank you for pointing that out. As to the reason I considered waiting and catching her in the act, I thought that I really didn’t want to be married to someone that would cheat on me. That is why I was so conflicted about what to do. I loved her, and maybe that is the reason that I never brought it up all those years. Perhaps I really didn’t want to know at that time. Also, the term “drag her out of the apartment” didn’t actually mean to physically drag her out. That is just a saying that I should have not used, because I didn’t realize that people would take it literally.

        In regard to controlling how my wife dresses. I believe the vast majority of husbands would have reacted the same way I did in those circumstances. My wife is a terrible liar – meaning she does not do it often and/or well. I could readily sense she was lying that night about where she was going. Her evasiveness about the location of the get-together was the first tip off. Then when she put on a low cut outfit to go to a bar, it was a real concern since I was worried about what she was going to be doing. I figured that an outfit that low-cut would give guys the impression that she was a ready mark. I didn’t want them to think of her in that way, and that was the reason that I wanted her to pin the top in a more modest way. Don’t you think most husbands in that situation would have attempted to do the same thing to protect their wives? If you don’t, I do. Sorry, but that is the way I feel. And I don’t think I was wrong on that count.

        The labeling of the cars as mine or ours can be explained. My car was the one that I had had a number of years before we got married. She never liked the car and almost refused to drive it. So we both called it “my car.” Then when we got married, the car we drove when we were together was one that we bought together, and we called it “our car.” You will note that I called it her car in one or two places in the prior text. So anyone that makes a big deal out of that labeling is totally off base. And I was also chastised for calling my wife’s night out as a “girl’s night out.” That is what she used as the term to describe that night out when it occurred. If you want to make a big deal out of that, go ahead. It was her term for that night. Today, if you want to call it “an 18 and 19 year old ladies night out,” go ahead. To this day, if I go out with the guys, we call it a “boys’ night out.” Maybe we should be cognizant that we are discrediting ourselves due to semantics, and should change it to “gentlemen’s night out.” Whew! Much ado about nothing.

        In regard to the swinging (and this may surprise many that there are 18% of married men and 10% of married women that swing), we have only been doing that as soft swinging until that one night. We had set the boundaries (I thought). It was no touching below the waist, and absolutely no intercourse or penetration. We were in the hot tub and heavily drinking with two very experienced hard swingers that were friends for many years before we knew they were swingers. There was some touchy and feelie while in the tub, but nothing beyond the boundaries my wife and I had established. Then when we exited the hot tub and went into the house, things progressed further than either of us had planned. Without the heavy use of alcohol, it most likely would not have happened. But, once in the house, my wife and the other lady began to make out. To both husbands, it was exciting to watch. After a time we moved to join them. At first, it was husband and wife, but then it switched. I could only see a portion of my wife and the other guy, but soon it was evident that he was giving her stimulation below the waist. I thought that she must think it O.K. to go beyond the pre-established boundaries, and I began to offer the other woman what I thought was the same hand stimulation. It wasn’t until the next day that the guy told me that it had gone to full penile penetration with my wife. I was not mad at my wife. I just expected her to tell me what had happened. After many days, I determined that she was not going to do so, and I confronted her. I didn’t yell or lose my temper, I just told her that I was hurt that she was not being honest with me.

        For all my wrongs, it does still surprise me that absolutely no one focuses on the fact that she may have had a sexual encounter with another man during our early marriage, but, at the very least, sneaked off and had a date while married. And also, while boundaries were established, she exceeded those boundaries, and I followed suit only to a limited extent. I didn’t get mad or raise my voice about her exceeding the boundaries. I only wanted her to come forward about it. I was hurt that she didn’t.

        Wendy, please do not send another email to my personal email address. If you want to post this and respond and let others have at me that is fine. I really think that no one will alter their opinion (including you), but I want to explain some things that should be considered. Thank you.

      2. Blah blah blah double standards questionable statistics bladiddybla stfu.

      3. Go fondle some more boomer titties, you big baby.

      4. “At the same time, if I had been the only one totally drunk with that woman I took out (assuming she was sober), would you consider my indiscretion to be rape by the woman, provided the act was completed? ”
        Yes. How is this even a question?

  19. LisforLeslie says:

    I love it when people excuse their terrible behavior with “I am older” especially when they are likely my age. Just because something was acceptable 20 years ago doesn’t mean you get a pass to be a dick now.

    Quit with the double standards (Slut vs Man) and stop with the nonsense statistics to justify your behavior. 85% of statistics that people use to win arguments are made up.

  20. Bittergaymark says:

    Wait, wait, wait. Did anybody actually fault/go after him for using the term a Girls Night Out? If so, he’s right about that not being much of a fuck up. I hear that term all the time…

    But really — other than that? Yeah, he’s wrong about EVERYTHING else. The “Gee, I’m awfully sorry about the slut thing — the poor woman was clearly a nymphomaniac “ defense is unintentionally hilarious… ?

    1. Ohhh it’s probably mental illness that makes her have so much sex! That’s the only other explanation and of course much more PC than slut. All better now.

  21. After the follow up letter, the only doubt I have is whether you are “slime” which an active imagination or something in your story is actually true. My money is on the former.

  22. Okay, letter writer, I’m “older” too, and I wouldn’t have called this woman a slut OR a nymphomaniac. I wouldn’t have labeled her AT ALL. She likes sex and is choosing to have it, okay? Leave her alone.

  23. Aaron Greyson says:

    what the actual fuck??
    none of you guys really helped the dude resolve his issue, or help him see that he should leave his wife, what she is doing is called lack of accountability. a lot of the commenters also see to be behind this stupid logic where it is ok for someone to have cheated or hooked up while drunk as long as they don’t remember.

    You know what that sounds like? the same logic that people use when they drink, drive and then kill people as they got in an accident.

    the same as a Bad man who rapes women when drunk and tell it ok cause he doesn’t remember it.

    the same as claiming that World war 2 didn’t happen cause i wasn’t there to see it.

    what is wrong with you people? the man is hurting and the first thing you do is rip him a new one.

    it would have been fine if you said all that AFTER you helped him but Nooooooooooo, God help if a man came to ask advice to a bunch of bitter women who somehow twisted the fact that his wife cheated on him into him being mysojnistic for giving a fuck about her.

    Tell you what whether you are a man or a women, dont ask for advise here on this website. cause from what i see if your a women, they wont honestly tell you your at fault and the level of your mistake and help you understand you know what he has faults but so do I.

    they dont hold you accountable.

    As for men, you don’t need me to tell you that most of the women of not all of them on this website are assholes who try to find the smallest mistake from our side of the story and latch onto it.

    go elsewhere for help, because they ain’t gonna stop insulting you anytime soon after you ask them for help.

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