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Disaster in Afghanistan

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  • #1096700 Reply
    saneinca
    Guest
    #1096717 Reply
    Kate
    Keymaster

    I think this is a little more nuanced.

    #1096719 Reply
    Bittergaymark
    Guest

    Biden is as idiotic as Trump on this. If not more so.

    Fucking clueless old white men who stay in office long past they have any braincells firing. He NEVER should have run.

    Just fucking die already. How much more can you destroy?

    #1096720 Reply

    Saw this online and this sheds some light on why he did what he did:

    “ Biden argued today that the disintegration of the Afghan military proved that pulling out the few remaining U.S. troops was the right decision. He inherited from former president Donald Trump the deal with the Taliban agreeing that if the Taliban stopped killing U.S. soldiers and refused to protect terrorists, the U.S. would withdraw its forces by May 1, 2021. The Taliban stopped killing soldiers after it negotiated the deal, and Trump dropped the number of soldiers in Afghanistan from about 15,500 to about 2,500.

    Biden had either to reject the deal, pour in more troops, and absorb more U.S. casualties, or honor the plan that was already underway. “I stand squarely behind my decision,” Biden said today. “American troops cannot and should not be fighting in a war and dying in a war that Afghan forces are not willing to fight for themselves. We spent over a trillion dollars. We trained and equipped an Afghan military force of some 300,000 strong—incredibly well equipped—a force larger in size than the militaries of many of our NATO allies…. We gave them every tool they could need. We paid their salaries, provided…close air support. We gave them every chance to determine their own future. What we could not provide them was the will to fight for that future.”

    “It is wrong to order American troops to step up when Afghanistan’s own armed forces would not. If the political leaders of Afghanistan were unable to come together for the good of their people, unable to negotiate for the future of their country when the chips were down, they would never have done so while U.S. troops remained in Afghanistan bearing the brunt of the fighting for them.”

    Biden added, “I’m left again to ask of those who argue that we should stay: How many more generations of America’s daughters and sons would you have me send to fight…Afghanistan’s civil war when Afghan troops will not?” “

    #1096722 Reply
    Kate
    Keymaster

    There’s that nuance!

    #1096724 Reply
    Kate
    Keymaster

    I do think we could have done a much better job of getting people out of there.

    But a war in Afghanistan couldn’t have ended any other way than this. One of the few things I remember from grad school in the late 90s was a lesson on the taliban and how Afghanistan’s culture was like a beautiful oriental rug that had been shot to pieces with machine guns. Like, it no longer exists. And no one had ever been, or would ever be, able to fix it. That’s why the Taliban is able to take control, because there truly is nothing there.

    #1096725 Reply
    Bittergaymark
    Guest

    Biden fucking voted to invade Afghanistan when smart people like ms knew it was doomed to failure. Now he acts like it’s a bad idea? Now?!? After blowing 2 trillion dollars?!?

    Biden is about as bright as Hunter is talented. In other words: NOT at ALL.

    What a fucking mess.

    America is nothing but a nation of feckless idiots. Just fucking pathetic.

    #1096729 Reply
    Kate
    Keymaster

    It made sense to invade at the time, after 9/11, to deal with the terrorist haven situation. Not sure what’s supposed to happen now in that regard, but I guess we have bigger problems with white supremacist terrorists at home.

    This Atlantic article makes a strong case that if we’d been able to get to Bin Laden and take him out in 2001, the war would have ended. Just skim the first couple paragraphs.

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theatlantic.com/amp/article/619767/

    You really sound like you’ve been influenced to believe that any democrat except Bernie is just as bad as Trump so we might as well have Trump. Biden’s not who I wanted, either, but he’s probably the only one who could have won. Meanwhile I think Bernie is doing some really good things as a senator.

    Meanwhile, Biden’s not stupid and he’s not senile. That’s Trump.

    • This reply was modified 1 month, 1 week ago by Kate.
    #1096732 Reply
    LisforLeslie
    Guest

    I think Sanders is the only current politico who didn’t vote to invade.

    The Afghan and Iraq wars were a disaster from the get go. The only people who came out smiling were defense contractors and their investors (Cheney and Co.). As soon as it was clear that Bin Laden wasn’t there, we should have packed up and left.

    The tribal conundrum, Taliban, ISIS, Sufi, whatever, is too difficult for our simple western approach. We went to fight the Taliban. We then decided that the Taliban was our ally against ISIS. And we made stupid bad deals with terrorists. We made deals with terrorists.

    We’ve spent 3 trillion dollars for absolutely no reason. We’ve been prepping them for 20 years. Why do you think staying a few months longer would have changed anything? Sunk cost fallacy at it’s best.

    #1096741 Reply
    Dear Wendy
    Keymaster

    I edited the title of this bc as critical as I feel about some of what Biden has said and done, this site will not foster the derogatory language employed by right-wingers. There are other sites to go to if you want that. Plus, Biden was hardly alone in contributing the disaster in Afghanistan and it’s pretty ignorant to suggest he’s somehow solely responsible for the aftermath of a war that began nearly 20 years before he took office.

    • This reply was modified 1 month, 1 week ago by Dear Wendy.
    • This reply was modified 1 month, 1 week ago by Dear Wendy.
    #1096743 Reply
    Quark
    Guest

    It was absolutely the right decision to pull out.

    We came in in 2001 and “desyroyed” Taliban within a few months. I use quotations because all we really did is scatter them and maybe eliminated their stockpile of weapons… which they then replenished using money supplied by other ME countries. But we should’ve got out after that instead of moving most of the troops to Iraq and doomimg us to a forever war.

    So yes, it was time to pull out.
    However, we absolutely, 100% f*cked up the exit, abandoning our Afghan allies and pulling out the troops before ensuring their safety. That is squarely on Biden.

    #1096750 Reply
    Dear Wendy
    Keymaster

    I agree that the exit was totally effed up and that part was Biden’s fault. Why did he not make sure our allies were safely evacuated?!?!

    • This reply was modified 1 month, 1 week ago by Dear Wendy.
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