This topic contains 36 replies, has 7 voices, and was last updated by Bittergaymark 1 week, 3 days ago.
February 11, 2019 at 3:40 pm #830635
Do appreciate the legal education, Guyfriday.
That said, I still stand by the fact that if somebody lends you something and asks for it back, it’s kind of on you to make sure it is safely returned. Perhaps not legally, but I’d say ethically, if you are lent something you are responsible to get it back when it is requested. Its not good enough to just say, eh, it’s here somewhere inconvenient (and unlocked apparently? That’s not good) for you when you want it, come get it.
They both sound like drama queens. I hope they stay broken up. Sure, he probably was trying to make her life difficult and maybe trying to force a confrontation, but also, get someone’s car back when they ask for it. It’s a car, not a sweater. How is he supposed to drive in from another state to get it from the sister’s parking lot? *She has his car*. As inconvenient as it would be for her to drop everything and return it, it’s probably *more* inconvenient for him.
If sister didn’t want to see him, ask someone else to accompany her. Or ask someone else to drive it back for her. Or take the police up on their offer to deliver it to the station in his plan. Or call her local PD and coordinate its return there. Just make an effort to get it back already.
Don’t leave it unlocked in a parking lot for God knows how long. And if he was able to get himself there to get the car, what’s to stop him from trying to bang on her door and force a confrontation at her home?
Honestly, if there is a safety risk for her, returning it to the police was definitely the best option. Even if he was there waiting for her, she’d be surrounded by police and witnesses.February 11, 2019 at 3:56 pm #830637
Yes, she drove it right within a block of his house and quickly took an uber out of there! ThanksFebruary 11, 2019 at 3:57 pm #830638
She was almost certainly right about him wanting a confrontation. If what he wanted was the car back he would have just gone and gotten it. It wasn’t far. It’s where he knew it would be all along when he loaned it to her. She left the keys in it so he wouldn’t need to see her. That didn’t satisfy him because the car was the way to get to her. He wanted to force her to meet him. When she wouldn’t do that he decided to use his friends in the local police and he threatened a false police report to get her arrested. All to make her come to him in person. I would never trust that guy again.
If you borrow something you return it unless the situation doesn’t feel safe. She is returning it. Just no delivering it. She isn’t being immature or irresponsible or a brat if she refuses to have a confrontation. If his friends are police officers and using their position to help him cause a confrontation I wouldn’t trust them either. That’s why she needs to go to her local police department, not his. His police department has a strong bias against her.
LW Your sister should avoid this guy entirely. She should cut him out of her life completely, forever. She should also send you copies of the entire email chain and she should send the entire thing to other people. She needs this documented in entirety so that if he tries something like this again there is a complete record showing he does this kind of thing. If she refuses to have anything to do with him he could easily claim that she stole something else from him. Something she knows nothing about and doesn’t have. He could get even with her by filing a police report. At least if she has a record of this being his method of treating her she would be able to show a history of this type of behavior.February 11, 2019 at 4:03 pm #830639
I mean again, what was to stop her from getting Andrea to return it, or her mom, or calling her own local PD, or doing what she ultimately did (return it closer and then uber the F out of there?).
She had so many options and she dragged her feet on all of them, making the situation worse. I still say, if there’s a legit safety concern, inviting him to come to her residence (or the parking lot outside it), is no better than any above option. If he’s truly dangerous, what’s to stop him from waiting outside until she comes out, and confronting her there? What’s to stop him NOW from doing that? If it’s that dangerous for her, restraining order, now.
As soon as he started causing a stink about wanting his car back, she should’ve immediately gotten it returned (I say gotten – meaning she didn’t necessarily have to do it herself but she did have to figure out a way to get it back to him). She is also responsible for dragging this situation out.February 11, 2019 at 4:05 pm #830640
I’m glad she got this done safely. Hopefully she is completely done with this guy. He’s trying to cause trouble in her life.February 11, 2019 at 4:08 pm #830641
It would have been as easy for him to get one of his friends to drive him over to pick it up as it was for her to drive it back. If his friends have the time to text threats they have the time to just drive him over to get his car.
Who really knows which one would have found it easier to move the car.February 11, 2019 at 4:19 pm #830644
It’s not about who has it “easier,” it’s about who borrowed the car—and therefore has the responsibility to return it.
You don’t borrow things from people and then make them come and get it.February 11, 2019 at 4:20 pm #830645
Also, she should dump this guy hard and never look back.February 11, 2019 at 4:21 pm #830646
I mean, but it’s his car. He loaned it to her, in normal circumstances, it’s her obligation to return it.
I understand these were perhaps not normal circumstances, but there were plenty of ways to get the car back to him without interacting with him.
If nothing else, her refusal to ensure the car was actually returned just gave him and his friends additional leverage to harass her. From a purely self-interested standpoint, if she had gotten it back to him ASAP, that leverage would’ve gone away. Then she really would’ve had a leg to stand on to say, he is unnecessarily harassing me.
I’m not saying this guy is a prince, but she should’ve just gotten that car off her hands immediately.February 11, 2019 at 4:30 pm #830648
Also – I continue to be skeptical that by confrontation Andrea meant a violent dangerous confrontation, and not just an argument her sister didn’t want to have.
I mean, believe all women, but Andrea never said anything about her being scared of him, or feeling physically threatened. Just scared of getting arrested for driving the car around, and he kept bugging her to return the car and threatening to pull in the authorities.
Frankly – if she was scared to be around him, inviting him to show up where she lives seems, not the best way to avoid him.February 11, 2019 at 4:33 pm #830649
This is a moot point because the car was returned; however, I’m pretty sure she escalated the situation by having her mom text him about the car. Who does that? If she didn’t want to see him, fine. But there were so many ways she could have returned the car without seeing him. She was being lazy. She didn’t want to be inconvenienced. The LW even states that. Also, the LW didn’t have the full picture. Only what her sister claims. And if she really was that scared of seeing him, she sure as hell shouldn’t have wanted him around her house. It was much better for her to control the situation by returning the car on her terms to a more neutral place.February 11, 2019 at 7:47 pm #830661
Making this sound like a safety issue seems a bit of a stretch. They had a fight, so he demanded his car back. I wouldn’t want someone I was upset with driving my car either. She told him to come get it, and “He was not satisfied with this answer, probably because he wanted to force a confrontation so he would get to see and talk to her.” That’s an assumption, not fact. Maybe the real reason he wasn’t happy hearing that was because the right thing to do when someone asks for their property back is to return it. It sounds like her refusal to return it was her way of getting back at him for asking for his car back, and his way of getting back at her for giving-it-back-but-not-giving-it-back was to threaten to report it stolen. They both used the car to escalate the fight.
They’re both childish and petty, but the fact remains that the right thing to do when someone wants their property back is to return it. Even if there were safety concerns, which the wording doesn’t imply, there were plenty of ways to safely return the car (police station, take friends or have someone else return it, leave it close to his house and not let him know until after she’s gone). She could have chosen to be the bigger person. She did not need to stoop to his level.