“My Boyfriend is Having an Existential Crisis and I’m Over It”
He obsesses constantly about what he wants to do with his life. He is currently pursuing a graduate degree at a prestigious institution but has decided that he no longer wants to continue on in that field. However, he has not yet figured out what will make him feel as though his life has meaning.
Because of this, we start arguing almost immediately whenever he brings up what he would like to do. I don’t really know what to say anymore; my opinion is that he should go a more traditional, business-minded route that I think would make him (and to be completely honest, us) the happiest and the most secure. I feel trapped whenever he comes up with another option that he knows I won’t think quite so fondly of and then gets angry at me for not being consistently positive about all of his ideas.
This is made slightly more complicated since I’m also in graduate school pursuing a degree that I love but one that won’t necessarily make me much money, so wanting him to pursue a more financially stable career feels deeply selfish and shameful. I do care and I will love and support him no matter what field he chooses, but I just can’t keep having these roundabout discussions that are making me want to start pulling out my hair in frustration! — Over the Crisis
You will support your boyfriend no matter what field he chooses?? Really? Because it doesn’t sound like you’re supporting your boyfriend now when he’s simply considering what field he might like to pursue. It doesn’t sound like you’re interested in supporting him unless he chooses a lucrative field that you imagine will help support you/your family together one day. Why else do you start arguing with him “almost immediately” when he brings up the topic of what he wants to do with his life?
He’s having, as you describe, an “existential crisis” and turning to his girlfriend of three years for support and rather than help him through it — like, by listening to him, brainstorming, offering suggestions and ideas, reminding him what his strengths are, letting him know you believe in him — you’re basically shutting him down at every turn, sticking your fingers in your ears and going, “No, no, no! Only one path will lead you to happiness and personal fulfillment and that’s a traditional, business-minded one!” Are you sure you don’t mean that’s the only path he can take that will lead to happiness for you?
Your boyfriend is allowed to not have it all figured out. He’s allowed to consider different career options. He’s allowed to change course, especially considering that he isn’t married yet and doesn’t have kids and a family to support (not that he couldn’t make a career change if he did, but it’s less complicated when you’re not supporting anyone else). This is the right time for him to think about his future. It’s much better he do some major soul-searching about his future now than after graduate school or after he lands a job or after he puts ten years into a soul-sucking career he hates.
And it’s the right time for you to do some major soul-searching too. What does this relationship really mean to you? Does it mean enough that you’d be willing to give up your fantasy of being financially supported and maybe create a new fantasy – perhaps one that doesn’t involve your boyfriend working a career he isn’t passionate about? Or do you simply see him as part of a larger picture – maybe one in which he isn’t even a main focus? Do you think of him as replaceable? Is it more important to have someone who will be the breadwinner than it is to be with this particular man?
You say you’re tired of your “roundabout” discussions, but what you’re describing don’t sound like discussions. And the only thing “roundabout” about them is how they keep coming back ’round to your desire for your boyfriend to pursue what YOU think is best for him/you. But it’s his life. You may not be in the picture five years from now. And if you want to be, I highly recommend getting over yourself and being a bigger support to your boyfriend. Reserve the judgment and frustration and let him work through what he has to work through to figure out where he wants to go and how to get there. If you decide it’s not a place you want to travel along with him, MOA. But don’t fight him to change paths simply to suit your own agenda.
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If you have a relationship/dating question I can help answer, you can send me your letters at [email protected].
I don’t know…I kind of disagree with Wendy on this one. Or maybe just have a different opinion. I read the letter as the LW is saying that her boyfriend can’t figure out what to do with his life, so they’ve had this discussion over and over again. Having any discussion with a partner over and over again will wear anyone down. So I got the impression that she was like “pick something already!”. And I understand that. One of my friends is going through this and having these discussions with her are wearing me down. Plus, the LW is entitled to have her opinion about what she thinks he should do, and if she hasn’t changed her opinion she’s probably run out of ways to respond to his ideas. Maybe he really is suited towards business and has talents that he can’t recognize in himself.
But I think the real problem is that he hasn’t figured out what he wants from his life, so she can’t plan her life around his non-plan. I mean he may want to move to India to study Yoga! Or become a photographer for National Geographic. So I think he needs to spend some time on his own figuring out what he wants to do before they settle down together.
that could be happening, and i thought that too, but what set me off was “whenever he comes up with another option that he knows I won’t think quite so fondly of”. she isn’t thinking of him at all, in my opinion. she is thinking about herself and what is going to set herself up for the future.
Kerrycontrary I got the same impression from the LW that you did.
I agree with you, and with what Katie said: he sounds exhausting and she sounds fed up. She knows she’s not being totally fair, but her main gripe is their merry-go-round conversations.
WWS.
bottom line, its his life. he gets to live it the way he chooses, and a good partner will support him in whatever path he does chooses. ill be totally honest, you sound like a MRS degree seeker to me… going to college just to land a husband (and a rich husband at that…), become a stay at home mother/wife and let him make all the money.
also, if money means so much to you, why didnt YOU pursue a degree that would make you a lot of money?
I agree to a large extent with Wendy’s response, but I can also sympathize with the LW. My boyfriend is also somewhat directionless, and it can get frustrating (he’s also unemployed and doesn’t have a lot of work experience).
The way I feel is that if my bf had a low-paying career but was passionate about it, I would of course support him; but, since he doesn’t seem to be interested in much of anything (or, just as problematically, he’s interested in EVERYTHING!), I feel like he might as well do something to make decent money. I actually feel this way about my own career as well, in that I’d take a pay cut for a job I love, but as long as I’m not working in my chosen field I should at least try to make and save up money. I will give the LW the benefit of the doubt and assume that maybe she has a stance similar to this.
I totally agree with Wendy.
We are supposed to be supportive of our SOs, not try to dictate what they should do with their lives (to make our lives better).
Why don´t you, LW get into a business related field to make money? That would make you miserable, no? Maybe it would make your BF miserable, too.
A good idea might be for you to investigate some career orientation sessions for him, a professional might be able to help him decide what he wants to do.
And finally, just because someone is in a field not traditionally well paid doesn´t mean they´ll never make money. My husband and I are in the health field, and a few years ago he opened a home health care business, and thanks to that we´re doing a lot better financially now.
“My opinion is that he should go a more traditional, business-minded route that I think would make him (and to be completely honest, us) the happiest and the most secure. I feel trapped whenever he comes up with another option that he knows I won’t think quite so fondly of and then gets angry at me for not being consistently positive about all of his ideas.”
WWS! LW, you are not supporting your boyfriend at all. He sounds like he is really struggling with what to do with his life and all you can say is “Go get that lucrative degree! I know it makes you unhappy, but I really don’t care!” That’s absolutely terrible. I feel so sorry for your boyfriend that he is dating someone so selfish. You should probably MOA from this relationship so that your boyfriend can figure out his life without you.
I have mixed feelings about this letter.
I mean, on one hand, I agree with Wendy that it’s his life and he needs to do whatever makes him happy. If the LW really loved him, she’d want him to be happy. She wouldn’t be so worried about what he is going to do for her.
On the other hand, I’ve got plenty of friends/family right now that are all soul searching on “what they want to be when they grow up” despite already having bachelor degrees and tons of student loan debt. No one is happy in their current jobs, almost all of them because they aren’t making enough money to comfortably survive on. Then they are looking into fields where there are no jobs or there is no money to be made. It’s tiring to have the same conversation over and over again with (multiple) someone(s) especially when we’re almost all 30 years old. Ok, you want more money? Why the hell are you going back to get your master’s degree in library science?
We don’t really know what it is that he is telling her. I mean, if he’s sitting around going, “I wish I had more money and I wish I could find a job when I graduate but I want to study underwater basket-weaving,” then I can completely understand her frustrations.
I actually have a lot of sympathy with the LW on this.
My husband lost his steady conventional job last October and then decided he didn’t want to continue working in the field and wanted to “figure it out” but as far as I could see he was doing nothing but lounging around the house and doing a few chores. He ended up going to counseling to help him figure out the process as this became a big strain on our marriage. It turned out one of the big problems is that for my personality, steady and reliable is really important to me and him possibly being unemployed for long stretches and me not knowing where our financial security lay made me cry and was terrifying. For him, freedom to explore was really important and being stuck in the same boring, no creativity job was terrifying. It took both of us realizing what the other person needed to be happy and really having empathy for the other before we were able to talk about it without me storming off or crying and him shutting down.
LW, I really recomend thinking about if it really is a deal breaker for your boyfriend to provide and if it is, why? Then talk to him about it. Maybe recomend he go to a counselor to help him figure out what he is looking for in a job or career and then talk about it honestly.
I can definitely see a lot of the points Wendy makes, and agree with them. But I also read the letter a little differently. It sounds like maybe the boyfriend has trouble sticking to a path and seeing it through. I have a friend like this; it doesn’t matter what he starts pursuing, he will eventually second guess himself and decide that he should do something else. He has changed programs/careers so many times because he loves the ideas of certain fields but struggles with the realities.
I am not sure it really matters whether the boyfriend has professional “commitment issues” or is doing legitimate and necessary soul searching about his life, because it sounds like the LW is not personally invested enough to stick with him through it. I got out of a relationship because of a similar situation once. My then-boyfriend was struggling with aimlessness, and the fact that I wasn’t willing to suck it up and support him through it made me realize I didn’t love him enough to be his life partner. Maybe that is where the lW is.
I wish this LW gave an example of what career paths her boyfriend mentions exploring. He’s pursuing a graduate degree at “a prestigious institution” right now– okay. Has he REALLY decided to stop doing that? Or is he just throwing out crazy ideas & getting upset when the LW takes him seriously enough to shut them down? Like, I am pretty frustrated with my life/job at the moment, so sometimes I’ll sigh to my boyfriend & tell him I’m just gonna become a stripper. Or a DJ. Or an erotic novelist. Or even a regular novelist. I’m really not serious half the time (at least, not about the stripper part ;)) but he lets me bounce ideas off of him & let my thoughts out.
Sooo Wendy is right… it sounds like he just wants you to listen & support him. Instead, you “start arguing almost immediately” when he throws an idea out there that “he knows [you] won’t think so fondly of.” That’s sounds kind of terrible. I mean, I understand the frustration of repeating similiar conversations over & over– but you’ll feel less likely to want to “pull your hair out” if you relinquish your desire to control your boyfriend’s life.
I do think that it would be difficult to have this conversation repeatedly. I also think that if he’s repeatedly having this conversation with the LW, then he’s probably also having it with his parents, other family, and friends. And he’s probably getting a different opinion from every single person he talks to, and none of those opinions are going to be completely supportive and unbiased– and all biased in a “I care about you and your future” sort of way. But everyone has a different opinion on what is going to make his future the brightest.
I think that just recognizing that you have an ulterior motive when you have these conversations is a way to have the conversation. It’s just instead of, “I think you should go out and do X and make a ton of money.” You should be saying, “I’ve realized that what you want out of these discussions and what I want out of these discussions are two different things. Perhaps it would be best if you went to the career center attached to your grad school to discuss this with someone unbiased.”
I was totally ready to sympathize with the LW. Having the same kinds of conversations with people who sulk sucks. Stop complainging. Figure it out. And do something.
But then she talked about her career and how it’s not lucrative and she wants someone to support her. I stopped sympathizing right there. LW, why do you get to do what makes you happy and your boyfriend doesn’t? That seems a bit unfair and yes, as you said, extremely selfish.
If finding a provider is that important to you, do this guy a favor and MOA. If not, sit and listen to your boyfriend and help him figure this out. Suggests things so he acts and not just sits around and mope. But listen to his needs and suggest things that might actually interest him. Do not instantly shoot him down because what he’s telling you doesn’t fit your idea of perfect.
And I’m sorry, but this statement . . . . “I don’t really know what to say anymore; my opinion is that he should go a more traditional, business-minded route that I think would make him (and to be completely honest, us) the happiest and the most secure.” . . . is completely WRONG!
How in the hell do you know that a traditional business job will make him happiest? Maybe you’re happy because you have your security, but is he going to be happy going to a job he hates just so he can provide? He will eventually resent you. I promise you that.
But she knows him and she thinks traditional business would make him happiest. Maybe she’s reading her own desires into that and projecting herself all over him, but yeah, maybe he would be happy in a traditional job.
People are portraying this guy as though he needs to pursue the dream of underwater basket-weaving that’s just waiting for him, but in reality, he has NO IDEA what will make him happy. It’s not like he’s got a special dream just waiting and the LW won’t let him pursue it because she wants the cash. He really has no idea what he wants and is just drifting around. If that’s the case, why NOT choose the more lucrative career?
It is always shocking to me when people want a certain type of life – but they don’t want to take the steps to earn it for themselves. Selfishness aside – life has no guarantees. The eggs placed in the basket of rich boyfriend/husband can break as easily as it it takes to say “I decided we should break-up”. And THEN WHAT? This is not good planning for your future.
If you are fulfilled in your career choice LW – then want the same thing for your boyfriend. How could you not? If money wasn’t a factor for you because you didn’t want to sacrifice any of that career fulfillment then you cannot make money a factor for your boyfriend. Does that mean you adjust the vision you have of the future? Yep. It should be adjusted to what YOUR income can generate in any case – because that is the only thing you have (a modicum of) control over. If you are more than your future bank balance then treat your boyfriend with the same courtesy. Your financial agenda can’t guide his life. It is a plan doomed to failure. Eventually he will notice where your loyalties really lie – and you won’t have to worry at all about how much he makes in his future since you won’t be part of it.
This hits home with me. When I was young, my dream was to pursue a career in the arts. I have a degree in Theatre and I completed a program at a very good acting school. This was all done without my parents’ approval. And not only them. I remember being at the dentist once, and when I told him what I was studying, he said, “How’s it feel to know you’re not going to have a job?” I remember my father telling me he didn’t want to be the father of a bum. My father described his ideal son-in-law as someone who wore a suit and carried a briefcase. After a while, I believed it. I gave up the dream and became a legal secretary. Not a bad job, but one I have come to hate. “Soul-sucking” is an excellent term. It really does feel like that. Now, at this point in my life a career change would be difficult but I am comtemplating it. Most of my free time is taken up with doing what I love: performing. I really am a happier person when I do it. Your BF is like me. If he chooses a career path he does not love, he will be miserable, and so will you if you marry him. Do you want to live with someone who hates their life? What if he becomes so resentful that he decides to leave you and chase that dream, whatever it may be? It could very well happen. If making money is all that is important to you, you should marry the guy my father wanted me to marry. (Maybe he has some recommendations, since I never listened to them.) Truly being supportive means wanting the other person to do what is right for them, not necessarily for you.
I can see both sides to this. It is frustrating to have the same conversation repeatedly and it is frustrating to feel like you’re not getting the support back from your SO when you’re giving it to him. I would ask myself if I had always reacted to this questioning what he wanted to do with this life the same way. Have you always pushed him towards more lucrative fields and dismissed other fields? I would sit down and think about these conversations and your reactions first. Then sit down and actually talk to him about this, let him know what scares you about him taking a position that isn’t as lucrative and let him know that you realize that you’ve been selfish and you’re sorry for that. Also, let him know how repeatedly having the same discussion does wear you out and you’re not sure you’re able to provide him the best advice possible. Encourage him to talk to an advisor or people currently in the field he’s considering.
And also like Wendy said decide if you’re willing to stay in this relationship if he does choose a field that he isn’t going to be a breadwinner in. But, also know that the whole balance of finances may change multiple times during your time together if you decided to marry. There may be times you make more, times he makes more, times neither of you is making a lot. And that can happen with anyone you decide to marry, whether they have one of the more lucrative careers you’re pushing him towards or not. At the end of the day though, you do have to be on the same page about finances. Talk to him about it and hopefully by talking to him about this you’ll both figure out what your roles are in this relationship and if it is a relationship you’re both willing to fight for even when you’re frustrated by the other person.
Here’s my two cents, for what it’s worth. Most people I know do not have jobs they are passionate about or that they find incredibly meaningful. The lucky few I know have been able to develop such careers. What I am passionate about will never make me a steady living, so I have had to compromise and find jobs that pay the bills but do not fulfill me emotionally, spiritually, or otherwise.
From the sounds of it, the LW and her boyfriend are both in their 20’s and trying to figure things out career wise. When you get out of school most people have the crushing pressure of having to pay a lot of bills and reality is very sobering. Often times it takes trying many different jobs to find one that is not soul sucking. I think both the LW and her boyfriend need to come to certain realizations:
1. The boyfriend needs to understand that he may not find a job that provides passion and meaning in his life. He may have to try several jobs until he finds one that he doesn’t completely hate. He can find meaning in many other areas of life and should not rely on a job to give him that.
2. The LW needs to understand that she is being selfish in expecting her boyfriend to go the traditional business route. She is asking him to chose a path that she approves of and makes her life easier. Why doesn’t she go the traditional business route and see how she likes it?
I would have to agree with Wendy here. Even though the economy sucks and it’s getting harder and harder to find rewarding work, it’s still worth striving for. Some people aren’t cut out for the suit and tie mundane business world. My dad started out after high school studying accounting, graduated college, and worked in the field for about 6 months before he couldn’t stand it anymore. He couldn’t take dressing up every day and sitting at a desk crunching numbers, even though it paid well. He quit and became a machinist for TRW, the company that makes airplane parts. He would have made more money and been able to afford more luxuries for my mom if he had continued as an accountant but do you think she begrudges him that? Not at all. While my parents are often a bad example, one good thing I can say about them is that I respect the institution of marriage a lot because of them. If you aren’t ready to have this man’s back throughout all of life’s hard decisions, cut him loose so he can find someone who is.
I just looked up what an accountant makes in my part of the world and its about equal to a machinist! May be different where you’re from though.
I can see this one both ways since I’m a social worker and my boyfriend is 4 years older is working full-time and going to school to be a teacher. He’s only in school because his original career field lost all sorts of job opportunities when no one retired on schedule and he only had interning to look forward too. He had to do some soul searching and I pouted a bit since my job is not very lucrative, but he’s figured out something for him, on his own. It’s going to work.
I also have flighty friends who will be forever searching for what they want to do. It pisses me off as I know that they’re spending more of their parents’ money in the process (as they’ve said so or live in the trendy parts of town with all the amenities while working part-time). That’s not going to work in the long run.
I wish we had some examples of what he was thinking about switching to or more on why he wanted to get out. If there aren’t jobs in it in the area, however lucrative, it won’t turn out well.
I understand Wendy’s point, but I can’t 100% agree with her.
On the one hand, I think it is very unfair for the LW to say “I am going to pursue a career that doesn’t make much money, but I expect you to make lots of money.” Very unfair. If you’re worried about your finances and your plan is to have a life together, the financial burden does have to be on both of you. That is, unless you have a set in stone plan to have children and have discussed one of you staying home with the kids. And at that point, the financial burden would change. But, for now… you both need to work to make your lives run… TOGETHER.
However, there comes a point in a person’s life where they want to date a GROWN UP. I can see where it would be extremely frustrating to date someone constantly whining about what to do with their life… about what is going to make them feel fulfilled. Ehh… shut up already! Maybe I am just the crazy old lady yelling for the hippies to cut their hair and get a job. But, I do feel like many people these days (myself included for a while) do everything they can to avoid actual adulthood. I don’t know without knowing this particular couple, but that’s how I am picturing the LW’s boyfriend. He’s afraid of being a grownup, so he’s delaying, avoiding, and changing his mind. And I can see where she’d be annoyed.
As far as actual advice (since that is the whole point of “Dear Wendy”)… I am not sure what to say. I think the LW really loves this guy. Maybe she needs to give herself a time frame. How long is she willing to wait for the “crisis” to be over? It is normal for someone in their early 20’s to be very confused about where their life is going to go. But, if she has certain goals and finds the situation still the same in 6 months to a year (or whatever her time frame is)… maybe it’s time to move on.
I guess i dont see the selfishness as much. I see frustration with a boyfriend who won’t committ to anything. I still think the lw needs to be more supportive and listen more to figure out what the boyfriend really wants. Maybe if you put aside your own ideas for a while and listened you could offer better suggestions that might get somewhere and then you could stop having the roundabout conversations.
Let me just tell you, if your boyfriend has been having this problem for two years, off and on, it ain’t going away. I live with a husband who is depressed, and call me crazy, but it sounds pretty similar.
I have been with my husband for nine years and he’s always wondering what to do with his life, feeling inadequate, etc. I chose to marry him, and I knew that this was an issue he had, but that doesn’t make it easy. Neither my husband nor myself are in lucrative careers, but we don’t really care about money very much, so it works.
Does it frustrate me sometimes when he is completely indecisive? Absolutely. But I love him, and loving a person means listening to them sometimes. You don’t just get to choose what they do and when they have their feelings, etc. If these things bother you and you are “over it” then MOA. Because, like I said, it isn’t likely to go away.
Okay, I sympathize with the LW because I WAS her boyfriend for a long time. Went into marketing, hated it. Went into sales, quit the first day. Took the GREs, applied to grad school, got accepted, backed out at the last moment. In my case, I was a perfectionist and nothing felt “perfect”. I know I drove my then-boyfriend, now-husband completely crazy. I understand what it’s like to be the crazy, indecisive person, and from talking to my husband, what it feels like to deal with it, and neither are fun.
However, at some point, your boyfriend needs to pick a path and stick with it, but you can’t be the one to force him to do so, especially pushing him into what you deem a “financially lucrative” field of a study. That’s not being supportive of him finding his path, that’s pushing him to do something that fits into YOUR plan. What’s even worse is you yourself are not in a field that you will be making lots of money, so why must the responsibility lie upon him? I’m sure your opinions and pressure are only adding into his indecisiveness. He wants to follow his passion, whatever that may be, and you want him to follow whatever path leads to $$$.
So, basically my advice to the LW is either move on from this relationship if your main concern is your boyfriend’s future pay check, or become an actual supportive partner, and help him with the steps to figure out what it is he actually wants to do before he wastes more years of his life in school and possibly money if he’s financing his education through loan. My husband was so supportive of me and believed in me, that he’s a big part of why I finally figure everything out. I had a shoulder to lean on when I doubted myself and it steadied me enough to work through things.
You can help him by making a list of what he’s good at, what he doesn’t like, what he does, etc. It sounds silly, but it really focuses your mind to see it all on paper. Then, draw up career paths/majors (possibly even the one he’s in now) that fit within those likes/dislikes/goals. Actively investigate them. Talk to people in the field, current students, job shadow, volunteer, whatever he needs to do to figure it out. It may not happen overnight, but eventually something will click. It took me a year and a half to go from marketing specialist to possible higher education administrator to finally a preschool director/owner (on my way there at least!) and I finally feel settled, happy, and excited about the plan for my future. Your boyfriend may not find a six figure salary on his path, but with your support, he could find a stable job and career path.
I think that you should go see a counselor or advise your boyfriend to see a life coach or career counselor. Those kind of people could probably help him a lot better than you could – but you don’t even seem to be helping him that much. I think today is kind of a weird mish-mash between the old world and the new world. A lot of women and men are growing up hearing that they can do whatever they want but also that the ideal life is still “college, career, marriage, family.” Especially for women, it seems to be more important that they get married and have a family and have stability. But I don’t think you can count on that happening anymore. Things happen. You could get marry and expect to be supported by them forever – but what happens when your spouse loses his job or if you get divorced after 10 years? Then you’re quite possibly a single mom facing the prospect of having to find a job that can support you and your child(ren). That does not sound like a happy life to me.
That’s why I’m completely adamant that I want to be able to financially support myself before I get married. My boyfriend is an engineering major and he’s always like “I’ll make so much money!” But I don’t really care about that. I mean, yes, it would be nice to marry someone who will make enough money to provide a stable life. Finances is something that people should definitely, definitely think about before marriage. For sure. But I think it’s super important that everybody is able to provide for themselves in case something happens. In case you end up divorced, or your spouse dies, or something. That’s why I’ve kind of chosen to go get my certificate in something that I think will pay more money once I graduate because I have no idea what to do. I might as well make more money while I figure that out. So, LW, I see where you’re going with that. If your boyfriend doesn’t know what to do, he might as well try a career that will pay him more money while he figures it out.
But at the same time, if you want to be with him and marry him, then you have GOT to be more fucking supportive. Actually set aside your notions of what YOU want for him and listen to him for once. Listen to what he has to say, and try to help him. This reminds me so much of my best friend’s current situation with her boyfriend. It’s a long-distance relationship because she kind of had to take a job in our hometown, which her boyfriend hates. HATES. But he is completely not supportive of her at all and puts a lot of fucking pressure on her which really pisses me off. He wants her to move back ASAP and I told her, completely honestly, that I thought it was a bad idea unless there was a guarantee that their relationship would be more equal and that he would support her emotionally if she moved back. I’m not sure if he is able to do that or not. It’s so hard for her because she is not getting the support she needs and he doesn’t seem to understand that at all. He’s being pretty selfish, and so are you. I think you need to think seriously about where to go from here. Are you going to make more of an effort and help your boyfriend or are you going to give up…..which will probably lead to a breakup?
I can actually sort of sympathize with the BF here. (Please don’t flame me.) I have a BF, who, like the LW, is holding their dream job. He was in a field he HATED, even though he was making damn decent money, he described it as “soul-sucking”. He quit his job, got a degree doing what he loves, and is now doing said job. While he doesn’t make anywhere near the money he used to (he’s a chef, working as a line cook, making $11/hour) he is so ridiculously happy going to work, and making food at home, I would never even think of suggesting he go back to what he was doing before. (Off and on design jobs for The Big Three.)
But then he has to put up with me. I took six years and one failed attempt to get into the Military, to finally get my Associates Degree, and it’s not even in the field I am pursuing my Bachelor’s Degree in. I keep whining to him about finding my passion, and how jealous I am of him, finding his, and living out his dream. His response is always the same, “You have things that you are passionate about. Maybe you won’t get to make a living doing those, but if you don’t let go of them, you’ll always be fulfilled.” And you know what? He’s totally right.
While I am getting my Bachelor’s Degree in something that I really really really really like, I’m also holding onto the things I love, that might not make me any money, but make me ridiculously happy. I take pictures when I go wandering around the wooded areas around home and school, I’m starting a scrapbook just for myself and of my adventures. I’m also getting more involved in the Deaf Community (I’m working on becoming an interpreter for the deaf for my Bachelor’s.) And finding this perfect balance of homework, school work, meeting people within the community, scrapbooking, taking pictures, and working is daunting, but I love it. I’ve never been happier or felt more fulfilled in my life.
And I sincerely think that’s the secret. You just have to find some balance. He might be way off base with what he wants to do with his life, but I think it’s a damn shame that you got to follow your passion, at whatever the cost, but he can’t find/follow his, because it won’t make up for your lack-there-of. You need to encourage him to maybe, sit down and make a list of things that he likes to do, things he’s go good at, things he could possibly turn into a career/job and maybe see if any overlap. If they don’t, maybe he just might need to take some time off of school, and work for a bit. Maybe he’ll find something he’s never thought of before. Just be there for him, with an open mind, and commit to support him in his journey. There are way worse things that could be happening to you both right now, and if this is what’s bugging you, I think you’re doing pretty ok.
I’m with Wendy here, too. Even a graduate degree at a prestigious institution doesn’t guarantee you anything these days. I have one, and it means nothing except that I’m in debt and will be for a long-ass time.
Anyway, that’s besides the point. Did you two ever discuss finances at all, or did you just quietly decide that you’d be the one who’d be able to pursue your not-so-lucrative career path? That’s completely unfair. And before you think I’m being all judge-y and not understanding you, know that I’m the breadwinner right now in my home as my boyfriend struggles with his [possibly failing] company and is seriously considering a new career path. It’s a difficult process, but I can handle supporting him right now, and I will because I love him and believe in him. And I sympathize with him, because it isn’t easy to admit that what you’ve been working toward isn’t making you happy or fulfilled (or, to be honest, making you any money) anymore. And being dismissive of the options that would make him happy is not helpful at all. And at the end of the day, I know in my heart that he’d do the same for me (and, hey, he may need to one day). Sorry to make it all about me, I’m just trying to give you a different perspective.
I mean…would you rather have a happy partner or a maybe-miserable one with lots of money?
Can I just say, I am APPLAUDING Wendy right now. In a quiet office. It’s getting awkward. But still, APPLAUSE.
I honestly could not agree with Wendy more. The LW comes out and says it would be better for her (“us”) if he had a financially secure job so she can pursue her less financially stable careful and get to live her dreams and make out with unicorns and moonbeams, yet she doesn’t GET that completely hypocritical and selfish attitude would bother her boyfriend.
That is some bullsh*t.
Lemme….just….try…..to say this calmly…….IT IS NOT OK TO MAKE YOU BOYFRIEND GIVE UP ON HIS GOALS AND DREAMS FOR YOU (I tried). ESPECIALLY when YOU want him to give them up specifically so YOU can afford your goals and dreams!! Honestly, what the hell?? And oh oh oh, the LW is TIRED that he keeps wanting to talk about HIS pursuits, but somehow her shutting him down and pressuring him to keep his $$$ goals isn’t making him feel better? Wha?? How could that be??
You are not married or with kids. As long as your boyfriend is providing his share of the rent and bills, he should be able to juggle dolphins in a rodeo show if that’s what he wants. He is NOT obligated to pursue a job that would make him unhappy for his live-in girlfriend. In fact, this is precisely the time he SHOULD be making this decisions and direction alters, before he does have responsibilities(but like Wendy said, it is still possible). You should be proud of him for really looking at what he wants in life! Do you know how many people pursue a career that they don’t necessarily love or even like because they feel they ought to because they get pressure from loved ones (HINT HINT) and end up seriously regretting those decisions? Do you know? Do you care?
Sometimes my boyfriend and I get in fights that go in a roundabout direction. We go in circles, over and over, and for awhile, we didn’t understand why. Finally, we realized it was because one or both of us (but usually me) wasn’t hearing the things that would make them feel validated, so even though the fight would seem to naturally come to an end at one point, one of us (me) would keep rehashing it because I hadn’t been “heard” yet. This is why you guys aren’t getting over your fight. You aren’t hearing him or validating his ideas about his career, which seeing as you care so much about YOUR career you know how close to the heart that subject is, and he’s not getting what he needs from you.
You wanted a boyfriend to make enough money so you didn’t have to worry about making enough money for your career. Your boyfriend might not be able to do that. Tough. Either get a new boyfriend (understanding what that says about what you want in a boyfriend) or encourage your boyfriend in his pursuits. If you keep him from discovering the career that will make him happy, then please don’t pretend to be surprised years from now if he’s miserable because of it.
I’m going to side with Wendy on this.
Definitely the guy needs to make a decision or two, and then will himself to feel good about them. Definitely, he is confused and needs to work to clear this up for both of their sakes. Definitely we all need to realize that happiness does not come from a job or a partner or money, but from within. It is an attitude and an intent. If you need some particular thing in order for your happiness to be complete, you will always be very vulnerable. Any married person knows that.
BUT:
Likewise, she needs to realize that she cannot depend on his income for happiness. Won’t work for her. She needs to stop pushing him to be something he doesn’t want to be. Won’t work for him or her. Even if he is being a bit precious and tiresome, their problem won’t be solved by forcing him toward something that isn’t right for him. Spending any number of years servicing her needs while effacing his own will lead to the bitter end of this relationship. If his indecisiveness is a dealbreaker, then she needs to MOA. If she wants to be with him, she needs to support him in figuring out what he WANTS to do.
My wife has been craving a career change for about five years. She left a job three years ago for one that was just as bad for her, in almost the same field. She’s still very unhappy. It wears on me. We have the same discussions over and over again. She has tried a couple of counsellors with not much success. It affects every aspect of our relationship. It impacts on our intimacy, because it impacts on her self-image. I want it to be over, want her to be happy, and want to get on with our life. But the only way i can get what I want is if she gets what she wants. No use for me to want to simplify her process for her, because if she doesn’t end up happy, I won’t be happy. So there are no shortcuts. We have to keep working through it until we get there. Even if wee don’t get there, we still have to keep trying or give up. Sorry, but nothing else will do. And she covered my ass when I was where he was, so i owe her that.
Our deal is 100% effort all the time. This doesn’t always result in bread being won. sometimes she’s made more money, sometimes i have. Sometimes we’ve been unemployed, sometimes for a long time (almost 2 years for me once). But we both contribute our best effort to the program, and we don’t blame each other. The difference for us is a long marriage that trumps any MOA impulse. We know we have to solve things for the long haul, because not being together is not an option for us. The LW needs to decide whether she wants this man for real, and if so, work for what’s going to make them both happy for real, for the long term. You can’t fake it forever.
LW, detach yourself from your boyfriend’s wishy washy ballet. You’re never going to be able to “solve” the mystery for him – it’s his problem to deal with so let him deal. When he starts up his periodic whining, just say, “Honey, I know you’ll make the right choice” or “I’m sure you’ll figure this out” and don’t engage. That way you preserve your sanity and he gets to be responsible for his “crisis.” Don’t dance the familiar dance with him any longer – if you change, he must change in response.
Just be sure, for your own well-being, that his dithering doesn’t prevent him from contributing equally in cash and effort to the household. Anything less than 50% should be a dealbreaker; no one should have an aimless leech for a boyfriend.
Woah Woah Woah.
Hey LW – If you wanted financial stability – why didn’t you go get that for yourself. Quit ruining this guys dreams and go make the future you want for YOURSELF. I’m not judging you for wanting to be financially stable. That is really important to me because I was raised in a financially stable house where we could afford vacations but learned that you would not get new shoes/new car/whatever while we saved for those vacations. I learned the value of a dollar. I never had to worry about whether or not my parents could afford to enroll me in sports. So I chose a career that *traditionally* would allow me to be financially stable FOR MYSELF. How lovely for you to get to make no money and love your job and make your boyfriend hate his life and make all the money. How lovely.
And another thing – the whole point of dating is that you don’t have to make decisions based on someone else. So you know what? If money is so important to you go marry a 50 year old CEO. If your boyfriends wants to do some soul searching maybe he should. The point is neither of you right now should be revolving your lives around each other. That’s the GOOD THING about dating.
P.S. In case I haven’t made myself clear – your attitude really irks me. If you want financial independence why don’t you go ahead and make yourself financially independent?
The LW and her boyfriend keep having to circle around to the same conversation because the decision about what to do with your life is a really big deal! It’s a conversation that needs be ongoing. The feeling I get is that the boyfriend feels a lot of pressure about what to do and how to provide financial stability, and the LW is saying, “Whatever, I’m just gonna keep going to school for art history” (or what ever she’s interested in) and not worry about making money. It’s a lot of pressure for one person to carry.
LW, I think what your boyfriend is looking for is validation and support. It is completely normal to question what career path you want to take and try to reconcile that with how you will financially support a family. I think what would help your boyfriend the most is for him to realize he doesn’t HAVE to make any final decisions. When it comes to a career, nothing is final. Tell him he can teach English for a couple years and if he doesn’t like it, he can quit and sell hot dogs out of a food truck. Encourage him to pursue his dreams, no matter what they are. And tell him you can accept that those dreams can and will change. He just needs that pressure lifted.
I had a completely different take on LW.
Some folk will NEVER find a career that they have a passion for, and that makes them go to work with a song on their lips every day.
Instead, they find a hobby or a sideline, and their passion is THERE. However, such hobbies (say, painting jungle scenes, hiking in exotic locales, triathlons, backcountry hunting, etc) require funding. Thus, the lucrative job becomes the means by which such pursuits become possible, as well as raising a family, etc.
In this case, I submit that LW is encouraging her SO to – in the persistent absence of a profession passion – to finish his current schooling and that will enable future opportunities. If nothing else, it will change the cash flow to positive from negative while he cogitates. It also benefits her, and that is the part that – to her credit – bothers her. But, and this seems important here, LW is not writing after a few months of this but, instead, after a couple YEARS of hearing it.
Sometimes when the perfect choice does not present itself, one must simply choose from among the good ones and move on. Maybe a better one will show up later, but one must have the means, etc then to select it. Please note that having good work and credit histories help if one tries to shift careers later.
Count me with LW on this one.
I feel for the boyfriend…i had no idea what i wanted to do with my life…i was good in the sciences so i went through school and ultimately got my PhD in microbiology…but i haven’t been completely happy with that choice since its not my passion, just something i happened to be good at in school…now i do have a good job (very lucky) but in the meantime i am taking baking classes at college part time as that is something i actually enjoy doing and i am passionate about…it sucks that you have to make choices like that when you are young and it can determine the rest of your life…think of how many people are stuck in jobs they can’t stand, not a good way to go through life…i guess if i could tell the boyfriend anything it would be find something you love and if you can make a living at it go for it! (oh and maybe MOA from the girlfriend who seems more worried about herself! not cool!)
I agree and disagree with Wendy here. And it all depends on the mindset of the Boyfriend. If this boyfriend has one passion that he keeps getting drawn to, then I agree with Wendy. For example, if he wants to be a writer and that is what he keeps coming back to, then that is what he should be supported in doing.
However, if he has a new idea every week and they are vastly different, then I have a problem with this guy. If one minute he wants to be a writer, then actor, then preacher, then lawyer. No, I don’t accept it.
Here are some ideas to unstick your boyfriend.
1.) have him take a personality test. Have him focus on his strengths and look at careers in that field.
2.) List his dreams for the perfect life. I actually made a bulletin board and put things that I wanted out of life. This can help focus what he wants and see if your visions match up. If he wants a family, house in the suburbs, and big tv fancy car vacation home stuff. That is one thing. Another is if he wants to travel, help people.
3.) Really have him understand that people who follow a “passion” have to work 20x harder than regular folks for less of a reward. If you listen to successful people, they are always doing a million things to make thier dreams come true. I was listening to the radio this morning, and this comedian said he would wait tables at a place that would let him leave for 30 minutes to do a “set” down the street then go back to work for another few hours. Ben Affleck and Matt Damon were waiting tables, acting, and writing good will hunting on the side.
I don’t mean to get off on a tangent but I dont’ believe you can be anything you want to be but you can achieve anything you set your mind to. Look at Dear Wendy as an example. She has posted on this blog about the hours of site administration that she has to suffer through to post a few things a day. She is also doing a million side projects. It is scratching and clawing and commitment day in and day out to go after something unusual. If he isn’t ready to put that kind of passion and dedication to something then he will fail.
I think the question the LW should be asking herself is how is she going to feel if the BF chooses a career in a low-paying field and loves it? I’m not saying that’s going to happen, but how she feels about it if it did will tell her what she needs to do now. If she would honestly be happy that he found something he wanted to do, even if it didn’t pay as much and even if they never were as financially secure as she thought they would be in his traditional field, then she should stay with him, be open to listening to him and just be more supportive generally. If she honestly, in her heart of hearts, would be disappointed and resentful that he took a lower-paying job when that isn’t what she had envisioned when she was with him for the last 3.5 years, and if she isn’t sure that is how she wants her life to go or she isn’t ready to let her ideal of a husband who is capable of supporting them comfortably go, then she should MOA.
And, I don’t fault her either way, to be honest. It’s not nice to say, but we all have expectations, hopes and dreams of how our lives will work out, and when you plan for one thing, and your boyfriend makes a U-turn, if it’s not what you want, then there’s no shame in just admitting that and moving on. They’re not married or even engaged and if their life plans don’t gel, then they shouldn’t be. There are plenty of women out there who don’t want to have a high-paying career. They want to do something less lucrative. They want to stay at home with their children. Or whatever. There are also plenty of men out there who still are fine with that, have no problem being the prime breadwinner and who chose careers that would allow them to do that and who are comfortable with that decision. Those men and those women need to find each other. Are there risks to it? Yes. Is it for everyone? No. Is it what I would choose? No. But if it makes them happy and it is what they want, then good on them.
What the LW should absolutely, under no circumstances do is cajole, force, guilt or manipulate her BF into a higher-paying career he doesn’t want just so that he can give her the lifestyle she wants but cannot afford on her own. If he wants to take care of her and that makes him happy, I’m all for it. If she just wants someone to pay the bills with no regard for how he feels, that’s a problem.
LW, you are the textbook version of a dream killer. You don’t sound supportive of your boyfriend at all. Who the hell do you think you are to make choices for your boyfriend’s future because it will make YOU happier at his expense? He is expressing himself to you and you are shutting him down, you ARE being selfish. It’s your problem that you choose to be financially dependent on your boyfriend, COME ON! Let your boyfriend be happy because I promise you, if he winds up forcing himself to complete a career in something he feels no satisfaction from, he will be miserable. Have fun contributing to your boyfriend’s miserable future, unless he follows his heart and finds something he enjoys as a career.
I think she’s focusing on what she wants him to do because, a year into this crisis, the boyfriend is no closer to making a decision about what it is he wants to do. Being supportive doesn’t mean yelling at him the second he brings it up, but it also doesn’t mean letting him be all scatter-brained about this, just sitting quietly as he runs through every potential career on earth (but never really looking into what it would take to do make it work.) I think both of them are not handling this very well.
I have a bit of a different take, and it’s likely to be wildly unpopular, but here goes:
When I was making my career decisions, I made them in tandem with my partner at the time. He was older and had a fast-paced, high-earning career that also had a high burn-out rate. I was undecided on a firm career path but was interested in teaching. We decided, TOGETHER, that it made sense for me to go into a field where I wasn’t a high earner but would have a long career (which would still benefit him — health benefits, steady employment, etc.) and he would make more money but probably not work as long. Please note that we were NOT money-obsessed, but both came from backgrounds where lack of money = lack of stability, and hardship, and we wanted to avoid those challenges as a team.
Then, 7 years later, we broke up, and suddenly the world looked very different. With my current partner, I am the higher earner, and it is very, very hard just to get by. I take responsibility for my choices and do have satisfaction in my job, but I can’t say I would make the decision over again 8 years ago. We make choices in the present that affect the future. When we’re committed to another person, our choices often reflect theirs. If one person abandons ship or changes course, it’s easy to feel ‘trapped’, even if you really aren’t.
IF the LW is trying to force her BF into making choices he would hate but she would like, then of course I wouldn’t support that. BUT, if she made her choices one way with his support because he led her believe he was committed to this “businessman” path, then I do have some sympathy for her, because I have been there and it’s hard to find the upside.
I realize how annoying it probably is for your boyfriend to have no clue what he’s doing and be making no progress. But saying that you want him to choose a high-paying field because you don’t make a lot of money and want a comfortable lifestyle sounds really selfish, yes. How is that fair? As much of a future as you two may have planned together, it’s not his responsibility to choose a career based on how it complements your own income. If you force your boyfriend into a job he doesn’t like, he’ll likely resent you down the road, and I doubt that having a guy who’s unhappy at work all day is going to be a lot of fun for you to come home to.
Wendy wrote: He’s having, as you describe, an “existential crisis” and turning to his girlfriend of three and a half years for support and rather than help him through it — like, by listening to him, brainstorming, offering suggestions and ideas, reminding him what his strengths are, letting him know you believe in him — you’re basically shutting him down at every turn, sticking your fingers in your ears and going, “No, no, no! Only one path will lead you to happiness and personal fulfillment and that’s a traditional, business-minded one!”
OK, LW is supposed to offer suggestions and ideas – but she’s not allowed to suggest that he go the traditional business route because she thinks it’s a good idea? She’s not allowed to question or have reservations about the ideas he comes up with? If he does, as kerrycontrary suggested above, decide he wants to move to India and study yoga, she’s not allowed to say “Hold up, I’m not so sure that’s a good plan”?
If they’re planning a long-term future together, I do think she gets to express her opinion on his career choices. If he’s all pie-eyed over his latest dream career path and she sees flaws in it – maybe it would require them to move, or he’d have to start over with his education, or it would set them back financially, or there’s low earning potential in that field – I think she’s within her right to express those concerns. I’m not saying she has veto power – she can’t just say “No you can’t do that because you won’t earn enough” – but she also doesn’t have to be blindly optimistic about whatever idea he suggests next.
Not too long ago I was in a job I hated and was considering a bunch of different options for what move I should make next. If I had said “I’m going to quit my job and go to clown college and join Cirque du Soleil,” I think my husband would have been well within his right to say, “Um, no. I don’t think that’s a good plan and if you pursue it, you can’t count on my support.” If he disagrees with me or sees something wrong with what I’m planning to do, I want him to point it out. Because maybe he’s right. Maybe he has a point that the Cirque du Soleil path is going to be a lot harder than I’m dreaming it will be, or that clown college will cost me more than it will earn me, or that being a traveling performer with CdS would put a huge strain on our marriage. Maybe he’s trying to save me from my own blind optimism so I don’t waste my time (our time) and money (our money) on a venture that will get me nowhere. Or maybe he can help me find a compromise, a job that I like and a chance to clown around as an extracurricular. If he truly believes that, I’d want him to say something, not just “Whatever makes you happy, dear.”
Totes agree! If her boyfriend decides that he is going to become breakdancer on the corner with a hat out, she isn’t selfish to think… um, what about that future we used to have? That isn’t to say she shouldn’t get behind risky projects (like a start up) or lower paying fulfilling jobs (like preschool teacher) if he decides that that is his passion and what he wants to do with his life — and sticks with it. Some jobs might be dealbreakers (wandering minstrel) but most won’t be. But before he settles on the idea, she gets to voice the pros and cons. Especially when its been so long and he is so indecisive and this new idea might just be a flash in the pan.
Your point about veto power is also huge — she gets to have feelings about his decisions and she gets to articulate them, but that doesn’t mean she gets to (or is trying) to choose his job for him. of course, he gets to make that call- but she doesn’t have to rah rah sis boom bahwhen he tells her his new passion if she’s not on board. Someone above said that she basically isn’t allowed to care about what he does from 9-5…. I totally disagree. People’s job/careers have HUGE impact on their lives and the people around them. No one is saying they are deal breakers but you get to care if he is an IED tester versus a loan shark versus an accountant. No one leaves their job 100% at the office and that effects her. She gets to notice. And she gets to feel “enough already” when its been over a year and he has a “new best idea ever” that will be gone in a week.
And she gets to be selfish. And so does he. We all get to( and should be) selfish when making huge life decisions. I’m not saying that she shouldn’t be there for him or that she should demand what she wants regardless of what he wants. Not at all. But it’s her life and she’s allowed to care about their socioeconomic status enough to encourage him to consider more well-paying jobs during his voyage of discovery. He’s being incredibly selfish by abandoning the track he was on to find his passion with his GF along in tow. But that’s great! Way better than if he suffered through a life of hating his career and resenting her for it when she was never asked to support him doing anything else. The goal, LW, is the find the balance where you both will be happy– you get to share your opinions and you get to suggest things for him to consider and he gets to figure out what he wants to do– to a point. It isn’t unreasonable for you to say: ok, its been a year and a half– you really need to figure out what you’re going to be doing for the foreseeable future. You didn’t fall in love with an aimless person and there’s no reason why you should have to accept one without comment.
Finances aren’t nothing — you aren’t a horrible person for wanting your smart, capable boyfriend to use his intelligence and capability to create a secure life for you both. But you should consider what is acceptable as a future and what is not and if it seems clear that he’s going to land on the unaccepable route, you owe him to let him know of YOUR dissatisfaction with that future. You both have a right to decide what you want your future to look like and to communicate well enough so you can enjoy it together.
(yes, I said totes).
I have a lot more sympathy for the LW than many people. I reread the letter several times and I actually don’t think she’s trying to direct her bf into a traditional field just because it will make them more financially stable. I think she genuinely believes he would be happiest that way, but in the back of her mind, she knows it would also be better for them as a couple if he made more money, and she feels guilty for thinking that.
I also don’t think that’s even the main thrust of the letter, despite how people have latched onto it. I think what she’s saying is that she’s worn out from listening to the same conversation in an endless playback loop for two years. I totally sympathize here. Haven’t we all had that SO or friend who seems to derive some perverse pleasure from going over the same ground, obsessively, for weeks or months? Maybe that’s her bf. And two years – TWO YEARS! – is a long time. I know in her place I’d have compassion fatigue by now, no matter how much I loved the guy.
My advice to the LW is, detach yourself from this ongoing conversation and the outcome. Don’t argue, don’t give your opinion, don’t advise or instruct. You could say as lovingly as possible, “I will love you no matter what career path you choose, but this topic always ends with us arguing, so I’m not going to engage on it with you any more.” And then follow through. There’s a technique called active ignoring that might help. When he brings up the same old topic again, don’t react, even to tell him you don’t want to discuss it. Just let him go on without any response from you. See what happens. He may go on to reveal stuff you never knew about.
I agree that listening to someone mindf*ck about their possible career options over and over and change their plans all the time would drive me crazy. It DOES drive me crazy! My husband had a bit of this and luckily for us I was the breadwinner, but when I was getting ready to have a baby I didn’t want to BE the sole breadwinner anymore. It had to change. He eventually, after 5 career changes and false starts in school, went back to something that he likes well enough. Then he said he wanted to be a teacher and go back to school for that and I told him I just wasn’t up for another change and that enough was enough. And while he was all starry eyed about teaching children, I had to remind him that there was a lot of other administrative stuff that he would probably hate and not be good at. I had to draw the line. And it turns out that he could not do the program he was interested in because he never finished his Bachelors… so here we are. It is true that at some point one has to pick a path and stick with it. It is one thing to go and have a midlife crisis and make a big change, but if someone is always wanting to change or never really finding the right thing, then it is more to do with THEM. Maybe he needs to be treated for depression? Maybe ADHD? And it is in my opinion, perfectly within your right to say ” I need (fill in the blank) in my life and if you cannot give it to me, then we need to MOA.”
Wow, I’m glad that my letter turned up so many responses! I’m not going to have a chance to answer everyone, but I figured that I’d put something together quickly here to answer some questions:
1. Me as a gold digger: My career path is a good one, I’ll be fine, and I’ll make a solid pay check (eventually), it is in a career that I love and one that I chose based off of my desire to pursue it indefinitely. I chose this path knowing full well the type of money that I would be making. I chose it anyways long before I met my boyfriend. If we were to break up tomorrow and I was to be single for the rest of my life, but I still got to do my job, I would be happy.
However: I mentioned that part, partially because my boyfriend likes nice things, he loves to travel, eat well and buy things that he likes. So do I and we both chaff under our current budgetary restraints, although I would argue that he more than me. Considering who he is, I honestly believe that he (and to be honest his ego) needs to be financially successful to be happy. Would I mind it if he made real money, no, of course not, but like I said above, I’m happy that I’ve chosen that I have for myself.
Also, did no read my last line?
2. My boyfriend: First off, he’s brilliant and unbelievably hard working – he could succeed at anything he put his mind to. He’s been pursing this particular career since college, but over the past couple of years he’s realized that he hates it. However, given the above descriptors, when we talk about his career goals, they become increasingly circular which is frustrating for me, because I like to find problems and fix them, not endlessly obsess over them.
3. Thanks for the kick in the pants to remind me to listen more. I’ve been super stressed at work taking up all of my waking hours and I think that this endless cycle of misery and obsession has begun to ware on me and its made me rather cold. (This particular letter was written after a fight we had had btw). I do love, and I honestly will love and support him no matter what career he chooses but in the meantime I’ll make sure to listen more.
Ya, I never got the impression that you were counting on him to pay the bills, so I hope this clarification will make sense to more people.
As someone who went through an existential crisis of sorts myself, it was really useful to come to realize that I wasn’t the job I did. It’s a struggle, or at least it was for me. You’ll meet people who are so freaking passionate about what they do, and you’ll compare to how you feel about your mid-management job and think “Wait, I’m supposed to be passionate? I’m supposed to have a job that completes me?” Well, not everyone can have that, but you can have a job that covers the bills and leaves you time for your family and friends, that gives you left-over money for evenings out and shows and trips and nice clothes. And yes, we spend a lot of time at work, so it’s nice to find something you enjoy, but it’s doesn’t have to be the end all and be all of your life. You can find and do something you are passionate about part-time, or in your spare time. It’s about finding a balance. It’s about being honest about what’s important to you (for example, for me, financial security, time with family, and flexibility are more important than a nice title and a super stimulating job)
I think it’s ok to tell your boyfriend he needs to come at you with more than ideas. He needs to have more info to back this up. He needs to have googled some stuff a bit, he needs to have looked into tuition costs and what his life and yours would be like a bit before he continues with these plans and with the brainstorming. Or maybe he can continue with the brainstorming, but it will only be at specifically designated times (you know, so you can have a drink and prepare yourself!)
Thanks for reading everything LW, and providing some additional info (not just because it seemed to reinforce what I was reading into your letter, but that was good too ;)).
Listening more will help, but please remember that you are entitled to your feelings and frustrations too… maybe venting to someone else every once in awhile instead of your BF will help as well. There was some good advice provided here amongst the golddigging remarks so I hope that you and he can take some of those steps… whether it be online tests (personality/Myers-Briggs/5 love languages) or counseling or whatever you may need. your BF might be the type that waits for the perfect — and ignores the good — maybe he can’t envision way into the future but he needs to start to figure out what next year or 3 years looks like so that you can decide whether the relationship is a train you still want to ride.
I’m totally on the opposite side because I know for a fact I could not sit there and listen to my significant others’ existential crisis over and over for 3 freaking years. I’ll give you a year. 365 days for us to talk it til your blue in the face and me be supportive and suggest all sorts of things. And if you can’t figure it out, then from there on out, the topic is going to annoy the shit out of me. Because damn, just figure it out already! Or waste tens of thousands of dollars getting an advanced degree you may never end up using, all because it didnt inspire you or what not. I’d be a bitch and just say “Shit or get off the pot, you’re being a drama queen with all this ‘What is the meaning of my life???’ crap.” But then again I’m super pregnant right now and probably not giving rational advice lol!
I think you be as supportive as you can possibly be. After all, you are one of the most important people in his life and he is looking to you for support. And if you can’t be supportive now, how would you be as his wife? I’m sure that there are plenty of times that you look to him for support and you certainly would not appreciate a response of frustration. Regarding his career choice, this is a very important crossroad and his choice will have a major affect on the rest of his life. It’s certainly not all about the amount of money he will earn; it’s also about his happiness and fulfillment. I would suggest that he talk to people who are already working in the fields that he is considering to learn more about what it is actually like.
I’m surprised by most of these responses, disappointed by Wendy’s response as well.
The selfish one is the boyfriend. She’s been more than patient and supportive over his decision to be consistently indecisive; I got the impression that she’s planned her future and is moving along in her life pretty well, sounds like she won’t need him financially either, maybe she won’t make a ton of money a year, but she can support herself financially. She needs this guy to become a man and make a decision so that they can both move forward. It’s not fair for her to be in a limbo of indecision.
She wants him to step up and make a decision, grab the bull by the horns and get on with it already. it’s callled being a man. I can understand how this generation may not really comprehend what that looks like nowadays, but men make decisions, they plan, they take charge and they lead. She can lovingly support him by stepping back and getting on with her life, maybe then he’ll figure it out real quick if she wasn’t there to hold his hand 24X7 and letting him know it’s okay to keep procrastinating. He should be taking action and seeking guidance of a Life Coach, Career Counselor, or a Mentor and work on setting goals.
That’s what this girl is waiting for… and there’s nothing wrong with her wanting him to be financially stable, either. It’s being smart and confident and knowing what she wants and deserves.
I don’t have a lot of sympathy for men who don’t know what they want to do with their lives by their 20s, let alone near-30s. Cost of college being what it is…I don’t think people have any business going into debt without a clear direction and plan to pay it back… It’s literally robbing your future self/family of stability as $ earned/saved in your 20s has so much more time to grow than in your 30s. A degree is just a piece of paper … A box to check, maybe a foot in the door, but honestly any job I or my husband ever had (for me at least, every job I ever had, I was never even qualified for on paper, but it worked out beautifully–) all have been obtained through meeting he right people at the right time, prayer, discernment, and knowing how to seize opportunities as they’re presented.
Drive is fundamentally a character thing. When I met my husband, I knew even if jobs in his field disappeared and he got stuck working in restaurants his whole life, within 10y he would own one…that’s just who he was as a person. Resilient, and laser focused. Thankfully he’s been successful in his field, which he mostly enjoys, and even in the few times of frustration/wanting to do something else, he knows if he sticks with it he can retire at like 50 and still have plenty of time to do something different. Ultimately jobs are just a means to an end, a means to support what *actually* fulfills your life, which are: relationships, family, kids, community.
Personally I am w LW. She is obviously wondering about the future, it’s about time to be thinking about marriage/kids, and every backwards step and waffle puts them further from that goal. Most jobs at reputable places have at least some sort of tuition assistance (financial industry, manufacturing, engineering, etc) so it’s not like he can’t continue to pursue additional education part time via online masters programs or pivot afterward while actually working, instead of being Van Wilder. The bigger question is, whether he views what she does (marriage, family) as a priority at all. Wendy is right that she should not pressure him into a career he will hate, but they definitely need to have a conversation about what really matters and where they want to be in 10y to see if those visions of life even align, and if not, MOA.
Can I offer some practical advice for your boyfriend? I don’t know where you live, but have a look whether it’s possible to do a Core Talent Analysis somewhere (you could even do it remote as long as the analyst can do it in English). This could help give your boyfriend a great overview of his true talents (the one he already has developed and the latent ones) and what kind of work would therefore suit him. I had one done several years ago and it was eye-opening and gave me more confidence (in my case, it showed that I would actually be suited to be a manager, something I always doubted about myself). This analysis works also very well for high intelligent people (since you say you believe there are a lot of things he could do well and also because he doesn’t seem to be able to choose from a lot of different interests), cause these people tend to be able to learn to do well in almost everything, while that doesn’t mean that they would actually *like* doing everything or that everything would suit them well, potentially leading to burn-outs.
Whether or not this advice helps you, I wish both you and your boyfriend well in the future, whether this be together or apart.