Asking for a diamond
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I’m sorry, actually, no. I am NOT sorry. I think this whole conversation is just plain weird. NEWSFLASH: You don’t start a “family” diamond by ripping it out of your mother’s engagement ring when she is both a) alive and b) still married.
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It’s tacky.
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Beyond that it’s just oh so fucking millennial… This is all just in shockingly bad taste. End of story. If you can’t afford a fucking diamond or your very own — deal with it. They are the most vapid tokens of love anyway.It doesn’t have to be the same thing, either “just a rock” or an important family symbol, to everyone involved; it could be just a rock to her Mom and an important family symbol to her, in which case, Mom would be happy to let her have it. Also, even if it is important to her Mom, she may prefer that an important family symbol be actually used rather than kept in a drawer. She not going to know unless she asks, and I just don’t see the harm in asking, unless she feels that her mother is likely to give it to her even if she doesn’t want to, and she ought to know her mother well enough to know how likely that is.
“A diamond should always be offered not asked for.” seems like one of those Miss Manners-like rules like “it’s tacky to have a bridal registry, because it’s asking for a gift” which prevents a practical, and often appreciated, solution for those who have no idea what to get for a wedding gift, and was usually more honoured in the breach. Guests always used informal channels to find out what a couple wanted and many ladies were very capable of making it known that they would like a diamond without coming out and asking for one.
I wrote: “I feel like a diamond needs to be offered, not asked for.”
Not “A diamond should always…”
That’s nice how you picked out just my comments from 6 pages of comments *and* misquoted me.
Miss Manners doesn’t think it’s tacky to have a registry. She thinks it’s tacky to write “no gifts, please.”
I did grow up in a household with all of Miss Manners’ books on the shelf, and I liked reading them as a kid. I definitely don’t remember this situation being addressed. Nor do I see any advice on this in a quick online search *with the exception of a jeweler’s website* that wants your business, haha. I assume that’s because no one has felt the need to ask this question… they either know their mom would be honest with them and feel comfortable asking, or they figure, like I do, that it would put mom in a tough spot and is rude.
It is beyond tacky to have such an urgency about starting a tradition that you force it. I think maybe TheHizzy is too close to the situation and is losing perspective but the tone and reasoning given are really cringeworthy:/
Just the quick input of a jeweler’s daughter. My dad upgraded my mom’s ring and band several years ago. He also just constantly gives her jewelry obviously. Anyway I came across her original band sitting in the jewelry box and admired it. I know it is special to her even though it isn’t currently being worn. My first instinct was not to cannabalize it in a tribute to my relationship and unborn children…
Kate, FWIW I wasn’t attempting to quote you. I believe that “A diamond should always be offered not asked for” is a old saying that some etiquette mavens (people who are like Ms. Manners, however, I am not suggesting that Ms. Manners herself uses that particular saying) put forward and that is what I was referring to. A number of commenters were expressing a similar sentiment (it’s tacky to ask for something as valuable as a diamond) and seemed to be influenced by that saying and it was the saying that I was criticizing. (Actually, it seems to me that the saying doesn’t really apply to this situation since it contemplates a gift from an admirer and not a family situation like this.) I didn’t even realize that you were the one that came closest to matching the quote.
I am actually a fan of Ms. Manners although more of her created persona and the wit she uses than her actual opinions. When you say that she never dealt with this situation I assume you mean the specific situation in this case. She certainly often deals with bridal registries (and I would have said that she disapproves of them, or at least only reluctantly tolerates them, but I bow to your superior knowledge) and engagement rings. Just as a guess, I would say that she would say that because this deals with a request from a daughter to her mother, it is a family issue and not really the province of etiquette (or at least is subject to a different etiquette).
It is perfectly reasonable to want to hang on to the ring even if you don’t wear it, but it would also be reasonable to not care about it (“it’s just a rock”) or to feel that it should be used rather than stay in a box, wouldn’t it? The last two aren’t some aberrant absurd feelings that no reasonable person would hold, are they? The question is which is the mother’s view? And surely it’s better to ask her rather than speculate
So totally diverting from the original topic, but I don’t understand why we should still consider it rude to put “No gifts” in the invitation. I can understand why it’s rude, at least in the Anglo-white culture to say “No boxed gifts please” as that is seen as a cash grab, and our culture is still kind of weird about talking and asking about money. Which, it’s culturally relative but I acknowledge that’s where we are at. Half of my husband’s family is Chinese-American, the no cash rule is totally relative though.
But – I think when that rule was created, couples getting married where young, had never lived outside of their parent’s home, and consumer goods were comparatively more expense. These young couples *needed* help setting up a household. A registry made sense.
For many couples getting married these days, all of the above isn’t true.
I got married in my late twenties, and my husband and I had already been living together for several years and already had everything that we needed. If anything, we wanted to shed some stuff. I didn’t really want money, either.
Is it really that rude to include “The only present we request is your presence” in this day in age? Why should we force couples to sign-up for a registry and accept gifts because that made sense 50 years ago?
Can’t we say, politely, that we don’t really want gifts?
Also – I have not received a modern invitation that has not included registry information. Maybe not “on” the invitation, but in one of the other supporting pieces of paper that comes in all in that same envelope.
So if it’s rude to include any information about registries in the invitation, well that’s already being violated en masse, at least in my circles.
I find wedding presents these days so awkward. I had some relation married about a year ago and they own two homes and have anything you could imagine…it was kind of weird to look at their registry, because to me, it was all useless junk they already owned…they didn’t need another 24 piece wineglass set..you know?
Yes, bah humbug. But seriously!I mean, I truly wanted nothing. Nothing. I wanted people to take stuff away, if anything. We were at the point in our lives where even the idea of registering for “updates” of what we have even seemed unappealing. Like I have a nice pretty nice flatware already, I *guess* there’s even nicer stuff out there, but it’s not like we were living with the cheapo target stuff anymore even. We really had no ways.
I don’t really want nicer stuff, what I had was already fine.
Etiquette needs to evolve in this day in age so there’s a polite and socially acceptable way to say “Please no gifts. Like seriously, please no gifts. I appreciate the sentiment and that you love us and are excited for us, but there is no need”.
