“He Had Sex With Me While I was Sleeping!”
Well, this weekend I slept over again and we had sex and went to sleep. Then I woke up in the middle of the night because the bed was shaking and he was actually masturbating. I kinda moved around and turned over. He stopped what he was doing right away and put his hand on me, in a sweet way. He thought I was still asleep I am sure. Anyway he did not do anything else … and we just slept.
While I don’t actually mind the masturbating, the combination of the two events while I am sleeping are making me worry. It’s a pretty new relationship and I’ve never thought of something like this before. Anyone have any suggestions? I already know I should talk to him about this; I just wonder if anyone has comments or has dealt with this before I dive into that conversation. I have looked up the sex while I was sleeping online and a lot of stuff out their suggests it’s sexual abuse, or even rape. I don’t agree with this but it did scare the hell out of me when it happened. I am in my late 20s and he is too. I find nothing else about his behavior to be abusive at all. He is caring and sweet, very nice…..just wondering about other persons’ opinions! — Sleep Issues
Be honest with your boyfriend that his recent behavior — the combination of sexing you up while you were asleep and then masturbating next to you a few days later while you were asleep again — creeps you out. Let him know that while you believe his story about thinking you were awake the first time, you find it odd that instead of going out of his way to foster nocturnal comfort and trust, he decided to jerk off in bed right next to you while you slept. Something is off here. Wouldn’t he be a little embarrassed about his behavior after the first incident? Wouldn’t he want you to feel comfortable in his presence? This strikes me as a control thing. If it were just the sex-while-sleeping bit, that’s weird enough; but as you said, the combination of these two things in quick succession is bizarre and doesn’t bode well for him or your relationship.
If it were I, I wouldn’t share a bed with him again until I felt that some trust had been re-established in the relationship. Depending on my feelings for the guy, I might even dump him and MOA now. But you have several months invested and maybe you feel strongly enough for him to give him another chance. Still, consider these acts two red flags and proceed with caution. I’d definitely implement a “three strikes and you’re out rule” for the immediate future. If he pulls anything weird again over the next few weeks, don’t give him another chance.
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This is a little wierd. However, I am a sleep talker and walker. It freaked my husband out alot when we were first together because I would have full conversations that didn’t make a whole lot of sense but my eyes are open so it wierded him out. If you are like this, I really can see how this can happen. The other part is just plain lazy. Definately talk to him about all of this.
I agree if that were the case. But I think we would have explained it as such.
I suffer from night terrors, which is related to sleep walking and talking. And I’ve scared quite a few college roommates, boyfriends, my parents and my siblings on more than one occasion. But I always explain that I have night terrors.
I think she said in the message board that she does talk in her sleep.
I was confused. I thought that cporoski meant he did crazy stuff in his sleep. But after reading the posts below, I figured it out. Yeah, I could see how someone thought another was awake if they sleep walk/talk.
Fun fact – it’s hereditary. My Grandpa has night terrors. My aunt walks in her sleep, and eats. My sisters and I hold conversations in our sleep. I’ve done a bit of research on the matter because sometimes my night terrors really scare me.
Oh wow, I didn’t know that. Makes sense now. A lot of people in my family walk/talk in their sleep. My poor little sister has horrible nightmares.
A side note, trying to quit smoking and I’m experiencing the craziest dreams ever. So vivid. I feel like I’m never actually sleeping.
are you on Chantix? My brother had CRAZY dreams on that.
No, I’ve heard that though. I’m using the patch.
Nicotine replacement gave me very, very vivid dreams, too.
Somehow hit submit before I was finished. . . .
The crazy dreams really bothered my husband. He started taking the patch off shortly before bed and putting a new one on as soon as he woke up, which alleviated the problem. Personally, I rather enjoyed the vivid dreams.
Totally off topic but the book “Easy Way to Quit Smoking” by Allen Carr helped me quit in January, I didn’t use any meds or tobacco replacements and was able to quit without too much trouble, which had never happened in the past when I would quit. I don’t miss smoking at all either; whenever I quit in the past I still missed it and wanted to smoke. Good luck, it’s better over here on the nonsmoking side 🙂
I miss it like I lost a best friend. I know that sounds dumb, but its true. I should be at the Stage 2 patch, which has less nicotine, but I can’t do it yet. I tried and almost gave up. I’m two days shy of 3 weeks, which is amazing, and its gotten slightly easier, but its rough. And I’m getting bribe gifts too! lol. I’ll definitely try that book! Thank you.
Remember the rule of 3s…3days, 3weeks, 3months, 3years. You are going to have the hardest time right around those markers so don’t give up. You are almost over the three week hump 🙂
Oh wow, I haven’t heard that. I will keep it in mind!
Yea, it is on my mom’s side. my siblings and I all walk around. We don’t have night terrors, but we do seem to mosey around. I actually have the opposite, my husband says I laugh alot. There are stories of aunts and uncles doing the same thing. I thought it was normal because I knew so many people with funny sleepwalking stories.
I usually scream myself awake. As in, I start screaming, heart pounding, so I finally wake up. I have to turn on all the lights and make sure there is nothing wrong. Then it takes forever to get back to sleep because I can’t comprehend that something isn’t actually in my bed. Before I wake up, I usually get a glimpse of something that’s crawling around in my bed, like a spider or snake or other type of nasty animal. Occasionally, it’s a shadow of a person. Once, the wall next to my bed was folding down on top of me. Fun stuff.
Night terrors are also different than nightmares and they occur at different stages of sleep.
yes i have the whole things crawling in my bed too! i once woke up my husband screaming about a spider, we looked all over and then the poor guy was too freaked out to go back to sleep. i have a recurring vision of a spider crawling from my pillow on to my face. and another once with a wolf chasing my from the end of the hallway. sleeping with my dogs actually seems to help because they don’t mind being woken up for cuddling at 2 am, haha.
It’s crazy! I have to do the whole search thing too.
Night terrors are the absolute worst! I hate the whole “waking up paralyzed” part that I happens to me. One of my good friends has them too and we share stories, and her reactions are different from mine. Ugh, just the worst. I’m sorry you have to deal with them!!
That’s actually sleep paralysis, which is different from night terrors. It’s the opposite of sleep walking actually. My fiance and best friend both have that really bad, and I’ve started having it myself recently. I’ll wake up hearing demonic voices or seeing demons trying to choke me. Ughhh
Interesting. When I described what happened to me to the Dr. when I did a sleep study, he told me it was a form of Night Terrors, where you’re conscious but still in REM, so you’re paralyzed, still dreaming, but still awake. I have the same thing with the demonic voices and demons, and one time I could have sworn my hair was blowing from a beast breathing on me. I try to scream and can’t. I’m scared to go back to sleep when I wake up!
Have you been stressed out lately, or more than usual? I find that when I’m very stressed out I get them.
I read that stress, a rich meal late at night, alcohol and there was something else that I can’t remember can trigger night terrors. Last time I had one, I realized that I had a combination of all those things the night before.
I have that combo every night 🙂
Ha. I’m surprised it doesn’t happen more often. I don’t get them as much as I use to though. Thank goodness.
That happens to me all the time, it totally sucks.
I walk/talk/cook/etc in my sleep and so does my dad, but his isn’t as severe. My sleep specialist wants me to get those little motion alarms put on my bedroom door because I keep getting worse and she thinks I might try to leave the house/drive. My husband used to follow me around when I was sleep walking because I would take perishables out of the fridge and put them on the counter. I lost many gallons of milk that way.
There was a DUI case around here about a year ago where a guy took an Ambien to sleep, and then woke up in jail. He had gotten up, drove his car, got pulled over by the police and arrested. I don’t know what the outcome of the case what, but I struggle with how I feel about it. While totally dangerous that he was driving, it seems so unfair to punish him, since he had no knowledge of his actions.
My husband’s grandfather fell down a flight of stairs and almost died on ambien.
There´s even a case of a guy murdering someone while on ambien:
Never. Taking. Ambien. EVER.
I used to take it. I found cooking spray in my bathroom once (the result of sleepwalking, maybe?), but that’s the worst that ever happened.
I used to take my ambien as a hallucinogen. It was really fun. I got to hang out with giants (both gentle and angry. There was a whole social infrastructure), and my computer screen would turn into houses made out of glass, and I had enormous squirrels flying around the room. Sometimes my lamp started talking to me. It was really fun, but I shouldn’t have done it. It actually really helped me sleep, but I used it to get messed up instead.
I once woke up naked and couldn’t find my clothes. My roommate found them in the washer and I had done a load. so wierd. I found I was at my worst when I heard something in the house, like a tv on or something. do you have anything like that?
WWS – Sounds like a creeper, but if you like/care about him and truly want to continue this relationship, you both need to work to re-establish the trust. Good luck LW.
While I won’t discount the possibility that it’s totally possible this guy is a creeper, I would like to offer an alternate perspective.
I once had sex with a guy and I thought he was awake until he woke up halfway through and said “What the hell?!” We had fallen asleep spooning (me the little spoon) and I woke up in the middle of the night and felt his *ahem* against my behind and moved against him until I thought he was awake because he was moving, too. And the sex just happened. Turns out it was just his body responding while he was still sleeping, but I had no idea he was asleep. Made me feel pretty creepy.
But this guy could have actually thought she was awake, especially if her body responded and he couldn’t see her face from his position. And if that is the case, the masturbating the next time makes perfect sense if he really took the problem to heart. He may have woken up and wanted to have sex but remembered what happened before, so just took care of himself beside her instead, and touched her when she woke up because, hey, maybe she wanted to join in now that she was conscious, but he didn’t jump on her in case she wasn’t game. It seems sweet.
I’m not saying there’s no way he could be a creepy perv, but there could be a completely innocent explanation for this as well.
Honestly though, blue balls are not a real medical condition. If he really wanted to be sweet he could have just *not* taken care of it that time.
I agree. Everyone’s defending this guy’s sex drive. What about self-control?! I’ve been horny and not acted on it many times.
I don’t think this is about his self control. It seems perfectly normal to me to be interested in having a lot of sex with someone you’ve only been dating for a few months.
What I don’t get is so many commenters implying that masturbating next to someone in bed is creepy and disturbing when newly dating but okay when in long-term relationships. That doesn’t make any sense to me. If I woke up to my husband masturbating, I would either want to join in or go back to sleep and let him have his way with himself. I felt the same way when we were newly dating.
Masturbating when your partner isn’t interested in sex (or conscious) doesn’t seem creepy to me; it’s just taking care of a primal urge that doesn’t hurt anyone else. And who says he was even thinking about the girl next to him when he was doing it?
If someone I was dating for a few weeks or months woke me up in the middle of hte night because he was shaking the bed from jerking off next to my sleeping body, I’d be very disburbed.
Your argument that it “doesn’t hurt anyone else” does nothing to ease my mind either.
Finally, if one can’t control their “primal urge” they have control issues. We don’t walk around the grocery store seeing people whacking off, thanks to having self control.
We’re going to have to agree to disagree. I’m not saying that people should be able to masturbate anywhere and have no self control, what I’m saying is that I don’t see a problem masturbating next to someone you are in a relationship with.
Self control is important and the majority of men and women have no problem not masturbating anywhere they please, and the ones that don’t go to jail. What I’m saying is that this particular hypothetical situation (masturbating next to someone) in my opinion isn’t anything terrible. What is terrible is someone doing that after you’ve told them it makes you uncomfortable.
Hopefully the LW will tell her boyfriend that it makes her uncomfortable, and he won’t do it anymore. But different people are comfortable with different things (like you and me). You are uncomfortable with someone masturbating next to you while you sleep, so your partner shouldn’t do that. I am not uncomfortable with that, so my partner is welcome to do it. It’s not about self control at all (unless LW’s boyfriend can’t help himself, which she hasn’t said is the case since she hasn’t told him she doesn’t like it), it’s about respecting your partner’s feelings.
In conclusion (because this feels like an essay by now), my main point was that this entire situation could easily be innocent and he won’t know she’s against his masturbating in bed unless he tells her. It may not be innocent, too, we just don’t know until she talks to him. But jumping to conclusions and shaming someone for masturbating (when plenty of people like me think it’s okay) seems over the top without more information.
Good points. Hopefully going forward, now the the BF is aware it makes her uncomfortable, it stops.
Exactly.
I agree. I feel like a lot of the women here are projecting. And I find it refreshing to see someone so open minded and seemingly not so concerned with societies definitions of what is “normal” and therefore “okay”. We as individuals… MAN OR WOMAN… need to figure out how we feel about what is happening or no happening,.. and go from there. If u feel somethng is off then be mature and talk about it. Advice is fine but we dnt knw anythng about one another. Only “you” do. And then again , maybe he has a sleeping fetish? Lol jk… kinda?
Some guys have a fetish about having sex with women when they’re asleep. That may be the case here. I don’t know what underlies this desire, whether it’s dominance or something else. But I’d definitely confront him on it. Realistically it’s unlikely that he thought you were awake – unless you have a history of lucid sleepwalking – especially when coupled with him masturbating while you were sleeping.
Since you’re a dude, I’ll ask you. Maybe I’m clueless, but wouldn’t it be hard to do? And at the very least, less enjoyable?
I obviously can’t answer anything about it from a dude’s perspective, but this is one of the reasons I’m so disturbed by it. It would be difficult to get the positioning correct, so if she didn’t wake up until they were already having sex, he had to have been extremely gentle, so much so that it’s likely he knew she was asleep and tried not to wake her up. Sex requires some positions that are relatively unique to sex. There usually has to be some degree of female movement to become accessible, which makes me think this was calculated.
I know what you are saying, but if she is a sleep walker/talker, she might not. I can walk all the way down stairs and talk to my husband and not wake up. Once I made a sandwhich and put it in the laundry room but didn’t eat it. Another time My husband shook me awake because i scared him while watching a movie. It took him physically shakeing me hard to wake up. I have a friend whose husband dry humps her in his sleep. If you have this thing, it doesn’t have to be creepy like that.
When I was in High School I stayed over at a friends’ place and he was the kind of guy that would wind up dry humping anything in bed with him while he’s asleep. I didn’t know it, he didn’t know it… his girlfriend did, but she didn’t seem to mind. Long story short, we wound up having to crash in the same bed due to space constraints and after getting hunched on I wound up sleeping on the floor.
Well, that is the big thing. Most of this stuff you don’t know until someone tells you or you see evidence. It seems like the night terror people above know it is happening. so this girl might hump her boyfriend in her sleep and not know it.
I’d imagine.
When I first read the title my mind jumped to “OMG rape”, but after reading your story I don’t think it’s like that. On more than one occasion in college I’m sure I “fell asleep” while attempting to fool around with my college boyfriend after a night of heavy drinking, so I could see how this could actually happen. Plus, my boyfriend sleep walks/talks occasionally so I do find that believable. But the masturbating beside you thing is weird. I mean, come on dude, go to the bathroom if you really need to do that. I would follow Wendy’s advice and not stay over with him for a bit and def. leave if something else creepy happens.
But your college scenario is totally different. You were actively involved in it and THEN fell asleep, indicating that you were into it. Totally different from being unconscious and not giving that indication in the first place.
Oops, sorry I didn’t read the part where she said “after we finished” I thought she just “fell asleep at some point”. Hm…now that’s weird. Unless she was coming onto him during her sleep.
This gets weirder every time I read it– I mean, does the guy ever sleep? In each of these scenarios, you had sex & then fell asleep after (a pretty standard progression if you’re staying over with a partner) but he…seemingly remained awake? So I’m getting the impression he’s actually waiting for you to fall asleep to then go for another round.
True. I´ve always heard that men usually fall asleep after orgasm, while it´s harder for women to, something to do with the hormones we liberate at climax. I think.
http://scienceline.org/2006/09/ask-wenner-sex/
I just found this, it´s quite an interesting read (about men´s sleepiness after sex).
That is definitely interesting– thanks!
Some women fall asleep afterwards. I do.
I wish. Sometimes I don’t want to have sex because I’m already finally about to fall asleep and I know if we have sex, I’ll be awake for at least another hour after it. He falls asleep instantly.
Is it just the adrenaline going from any other physical activity, or do you think it’s a hormone issue?
I think its just adreneline.
Same here– I can be tired, but as soon as I have sex, I’m awake again & my boyfriend’s nodding off. I’ve told him to do me in the morning sometimes, just so I’ll want to get out of bed 🙂
He’s the type that will be sleepy right after, but it’s manageable as long as he’s not already tired. Some guys I’ve been with don’t get sleepy though; I knew one who’d smoke a cigarette & be hopping around the room.
Morning = good wake up. Night = good night cap.
It’s opposite for my boyfriend and me. I’m much more likely to pass right out while we cuddle after, while he’ll get all hyper and have to get up and do something.
I kind of disagree. He apologized more than once which makes it seem sincere. And the masturbating while she was in bed? Not that weird. Maybe he was masturbating because he didn’t want to take the chance of having sex with her again while she was asleep. My fiance has occasionally masturbated in bed while I was asleep (I asked him about it once because I was curious) and I have other friends who boyfriends have done the same thing. I’ve masturbated in bed while my fiance was asleep- I didn’t want to wake him up and didn’t want to get out of bed.
LW- I think you need to have an honest conversation with him about your feelings and see how he reacts to it. If anything else weird comes up, then yes you should worry but right now I think you (and everyone else) may be blowing it a bit out of proportion.
I agree about it actually seeming sincere. He did bring it up again the next day after all.
However, I know people will say ‘my fiance’ or ‘my husband’ will do that from time to time, which I think is certainly more normal than someone you’ve only dated a few months. Don’t you find it pretty weird that after such a short time, he’s already doing this? It really seems strange to me. I’d be very creeped out.
Agreed. It’s the sort of behavior you only do in a long-term relationship that’s attempting to create sustainable patterns.
In terms of a fiance or other very committed relationship, I would have to agree: masturbating while the other person is asleep next to you isn’t that weird. When I was with my ex, we both did it on occasion. Our work schedules didn’t often line up, so there would be a random night where one of us would be ready to go and the other would be too tired. Hey, it’s way better than finding someone else to bang right? The only thing that strikes me as a bit odd in this case is that they’ve only been dating for a few months so it’s still a fairly new relationship. After just a few months, many people would still refuse to clip their toenails or pee in front of their SO because the relationship just isn’t that familiar yet.
haha, I will never clip my toenails or pee in front of my SO. Never gonna happen, not even on long backpacking trips.
Never say never. I was like that until, 7 months into living together I fainted and then convulsed in front of my husband (losing control of my bodily functions while at it). Not to mention him being present in both natural births. 🙂
haha, But did you continue to do it afterwards in regular life? It’s totally acceptable in those sorts of situations.
PS – Is birth really THAT messy besides, you know, the blood and afterbirth and baby slime? I have this picture perfect image of giving birth with my future husband there, helping out the doctor, and the only gross things happening are baby slime.
Is birth really that messy? YES, way, way messier than you described.
Yes, I’ve had 5 children and my husband did his best to stay up near my head and not look at what was going on “down there.” You’ll poop and pee. It almost always happens but women don’t know it happens to them because the medical team is used to it and just wipes it away and without saying anything. The only reason I know for sure it happened to me once is because my husband said something, but I would not be surprised if it actually happened every time and I just wasn’t made aware of it.
And then there’s the amniotic fluid that will make you feel like you’ve just peed yourself. And the blood. So much blood made to look like more from all the other fluids. I never threw up but I’m a bleeder.
But to this day after 17 yrs of marriage, 5 babies and a surgery requiring my husband to empty my surgical drains (talk about nastiness), I still close the bathroom door! We do not pee in front of each other.
Yeah, plus the placenta is nasty. I was my best friend’s labour coach for 2 kids and while I am so blessed to have watched her children coming into the world… watching someone give birth is the most disgusting thing I’ve ever witnessed.
I didn´t see the placenta, but the umbilical cord of my 1st really grossed me out, the 2nd´s was totally different, and more what I expected.
Ha! There is baby slime, lots of blood and amniotic fluid, and BARF. No one mentions that part, but when my contractions were right on top of each other, I started projectile vomiting. I was in so much excruciating pain and I had blood and amniotic fluid gushing down my legs and vomit just pouring out of my mouth.
Yes, childbirth is messy — physically and emotionally.
Worse than barf…poop! It didn’t happen to me, but I was a labor coach for a friend and got to watch that. Ewww!
Ugh, I didn´t vomit with either, luckily WIth my 2nd (which was a bit harder labour) I know I peed for sure, and I think I might have pooped a little, but my husband swears I didn´t. Whether to save me the embarrassment or becasuse it´s true, I don´t know.
Oh, right. That didn’t happen to me either, but I hear it often does.
Nobody warned me about the barfing. Now I tell every lady I know, not to scare her, but just as a head’s up. Everyone warned me about the pooping (which I didn’t do, but while in labor you really don’t care WHAT you do, as long as you get the baby out) but no one told me about barfing. I was in intense labor and same thing as Wendy, just barfing like crazy. So, yes, it’s messy.
I don´t pee in front of him intentionally, but usually at least one of the girls barges in when I´m in the bathroom, so the door stays open after that.
Let´s just say there´s not much mystery left 🙂
I’ve slowly done all the things I swore I’d never do in front of him. The only thing I truly never do, and swear to him that I never do even when he’s not around, is fart. Its silly, but at least I have something left!
However, in the spirit of giving credit where its due, thanks to DW (and, ok, BGM) I try really hard to not get “lazy” in the relationship. I’ve heard enough on here to know that keeping the love there and exciting elements alive is super important. To be totally honest, I have a lot more sex even when I’m not in the mood initially thanks to DW.
You´re so right. I realize I´ve become a bit lazy recently, and I really have to do something about it. I´m hoping the 1 year old calms down a bit soon so instead of chasing after her all day I can actually do something for myself. 🙂
Oh God, I didn’t mean to make you feel bad. I would have exactly 0 energy for anything after running after a 1 year old all day!
No problem, you didn´t make me feel bad! I´ve been feeling a bit guilty lately, I even turned my husband down for sex the other day for probably the 1st time ever.
My eldest was so good always I never expected the youngest to be the tasmanian devil!
I never let the kids in the kids in the bathroom either. I’d lock the door. Sure, when they were little they’d try to barge in or would at least knock but I established pretty early on that mom is allowed to have privacy to use the bathroom. Sometimes it was the only private time I got in a day.
Yeah, that’s the thing– in long-term relationships, this kind of behavior can be seen as normal because there was (at some point) a conversation. The difference here is that they’ve only been dating a few months & trust hasn’t been sufficiently established. I think that’s why the LW (& a lot of commenters) are finding her boyfriend a bit off.
I think that there is definitely a possibility this guy is a creeper, but something similar has happened to me and in my case it’s totally innocent. So I just wanted to throw out there that it’s possible he is innocent. My boyfriend and I both try to have sex with each other in our sleep. We’ve started doing it while we were both asleep several times. We also both talk in our sleep, and actually respond to each other. There have been times where he’s come on to me, talking included, and I thought he was awake, only to find out afterward that he woke up in the middle. It doesn’t bother us, but I can definitely see how it would.
I could have written the exact same thing. We don’t do it much anymore – but we did at the want-each-other-all-the-time stage. Once we got woke up in the middle at the same time and were like WTF who started this?!?! I’m tired. But I also talk a lot in my sleep. I have gotten in a fight with him in my sleep before because I was having a dream that he was cheating on me and so I wouldn’t let him touch me – and he was awake and thoroughly confused. Some people just have weird sleep situations.
I just think the fact that she’s so creeped out by it means that maybe she has other subconscious red flags. I was never creeped out by it because I knew him and loved him and trusted him. But she might not at this point – and that’s okay. I’m just curious about what reservations she has about him in their awake life.
Lol – I love the image of both of you waking up simultaneously surprised you are having sex.
My ex and I were also both guilty of sleep-sex. It does happen. I’ve had sex with him when I thought he was awake, and it turns out he was not (and vice versa).
I’m reacting very badly to this letter because the first Mr. Pinky used to do this. He turned out to be an emotionally and physically abusive control freak, but that didn’t crop up until after we were married. The first time my ex tried to have sex with me while I was asleep, he apologized to me profusely. Then it happened again…and again. This is called spousal rape. It is abuse. I could have lived with it if all the other factors of abuse didn’t exist in the relationship, but the ex Mr. Pinky was just a ghastly person in every aspect. I learned that if a man forces himself on you while you are asleep or inebriated, he will probably demonstrate other toxic tendencies.
What ultimately drove me away from my former spouse is that he had no compassion or understanding for my feelings. He wanted sex and I was his spouse and it was my responsibility to submit.
So, my immediate reaction to what is happening to the letter writer is to get as far away from this guy as you can. It will only get worse.
This is what I was thinking when I read it on the forum, not that I have experience with it, but it does comes across as a sign of abuse. It seems really disturbing to me.
I don’t doubt that your ex used sex while you were sleeping as a means of control, abuse, and manipulation and was spousal rape. However, engaging in sex acts with your partner while they are asleep (at least at the beginning) is not inherently abusive. It depends on the people’s understanding of consent.
Think about the cosmo-style advice to spice up a relationship by waking up your boyfriend or husband by giving him blowjob. While perhaps tacky advice, it isn’t telling people to rape their partners. Their is an implicit understanding that he has and will consented to this act, even though he’s alseep when it begins. If only because no one expects that he would stay asleep the whole time and would presumable make any lack of consent known immediately.
Waking up to your partner stroking your breasts or rubbing your clitoris – or even being entered by a trusted partner– can be seen my many women as a nice way to wake up. This of course is not the same thing as an abusive man “taking what is his” by forcefully fucking his sleeping wife, regardless of her response when she wakes up. I don’t doubt your experience but it may be useful to understand that your ex used it as a TOOL of abuse — the general act itself is not inherently abusive and can be used by loving partners as a way of expressing their affection and desire, rather than power and control.
I’ve had a whole slew of guys in my life that have done that to me (woken me up, uh, Cosmo style…) and it definitely IS a fantastic way to be woken up…
I’m going to refer to it as “cosmo style” next time I do this.
I’m so glad Wendy found it all bizarre too. I felt like I was the only one on the thread that found this really weird.
I also find it weird. Plaisible, yes… But still weird. I guess I just want to give this guy the benefit of the doubt that he honestly thought she was awake the first time, and then didnt want a repeat the second time, so he took care of it himself. Weird, yes, but not sinister (I hope)
Really? I thought I made it pretty clear that I’m pretty disturbed by it, and that I think it’s definitely rape. There’s just no way it adds up that he didn’t make a specific effort to have sex with her while she was sleeping.
Oh maybe you posted after me? Or I just didn’t notice yours. It seemed like a lot of people found this no so weird.
I’m not buying the talking in her sleep thing as enough reason for him to think she is awake. When people talk in their sleep, it’s usually pretty clear that it’s sleep talking. It is often incoherent or mumbling. Even if it sounded like real talking, I doubt she was actually carrying on a conversation with him. Plus, the lack of moving anything, arms or whatever, should have tipped him off. Unless she’s had this problem before, it seems too shady.
Anyway, masturbation isn’t weird on its own, but in a bed with his new girlfriend is. Especially if you’ve already had sex. I think this dude is a weirdo. Even if the LW talks to him about this, I don’t think there’s really anything that would make her trust him at this point.
Lots of people can trick others that they are really awake- movement, carry on conversations, ect… And if she “knew” what was going on (as in as she was sleeping, so she was technically dreaming that she was having sex) she wouldn’t have just been non-responsive. Have you never been dreaming about something and find yourself moving physically? Like a dog dreams about running… It does happen.
It could. That’s why I was curious about if this has ever happened before, which would make it more plausible.
My biggest issue is that he either knew that she is prone to doing this in her sleep and disregarded that while having sex with her, or she never told him about it and it was an honest mistake. I just think if the night talking was the issue, she would’ve let it go. I mean, she didn’t tell us his excuse was “I thought you were awake because you were talking to me about initiating sex”, and even it’s not an acceptable excuse, especially if he knew she was capable of that in her sleep.
They have only been dating for a few months…
My aunt, the sleepwalker, will go to the kitchen and make something to eat. She will also have coversations with my cousins if they are still awake and in the living room watching TV. They have some crazy stories about her. She has no recollection of any of this in the morning. Some people can fully function while sleeping.
My sisters and I have conversations in our sleep . . . coherent enough that my mom understood and could tell us what we were talking about.
My daughter walked into the kitchen once, pulled out her stepstool, pulled down her pants and started to squat to pee. Thank god I caught her in time. It was the only time she sleepwalked, but it was really scary for me to see her like that. Like she was a zombie or something.
Ha! I actually did that when I was six and staying at my aunt and uncle’s house when my little sis was born. I couldn’t even imagine what goes through an adult’s head while seeing this. Now I do.
If the apology was sincere, and it seems like it was though I have to defer to the LW on that, then I think we need to unbundle the issues a bit.
1. Your boyfriend thought you were awake and interested in sexytimes again, and it turned out you were asleep… he was/seems mortified and has aplogized profusely and it hasn’t happened again. Having not read the message boards I have to ask – did you tell him you talk in your sleep? Was this how he found out? because if he had no clue, and no experience with someone who walks/talks in their sleep, it would be a bit unfair to wave the creeper flags for one instance with nothing else to go on…
2. Masturbating next to you in bed… should this have been discussed in advance? Sure, but I could also see a person not thinking it is a big deal. I wouldn’t, and have done this next to my SO on more than one occasion. Am I ready to raise the creeper flag because someone was comfy in bed and wants to “take care of himself” without getting up? NO. Maybe he figured it would disturb her more, maybe he has a higher sex drive and rather than wake her up and risk not knowing if she is “really” awake he just took care of business.
I honestly don’t see how the two are related without additional details and info. Seems like a guy made an honest mistake and now the radar is up for anything… and masterbating in bed isn’t abnormal behavior in my book (so long as you handle the cleanup:))
I should add, I know someone personally who not only walked and talked in his sleep… but who ran around his bedroom and eventually jumped out of his window (the front porch roof broke his fall) and walked back into the house WITHOUT WAKING UP! he had a history of it, they had to be extra careful when he was little to secure him in hotel rooms, etc. because he would wander around. All this to say that It is very very possible to have sex with someone and assume they are awake without being evil because you would be shocked what some people can do when they are unconscious!
I think many of us just feel uncomfortable passing it off like this. You may be correct, but there is the possibility of abuse and it may just take some time to surface in a more concrete manner.
Understood, I just feel as uncomfortable labeling someone as an abuser when we don’t know all of the facts, and as I said above if the apology was sincere I don’t think bundling with the “He masterbated next to me OMG” issue makes any sense. Seems like 2 totally different things – one has to do with her body, and one has to do with him doing what he wants with his own.
Very true- if you jumped on every tiny weird thing someone did when you were first getting to know them, no one would ever end up in long term relationships.
I think she bundled them because the events happened in succession. She wasn’t over him having sex with her while she was sleeping and then he masturbates next to her a week or so later, and the fact that she is uncomfortable with the first makes the second event more awkward… and probably leaves her wondering why he was doing it while thinking about the first event and whether the two are related.
I would guess that this the first time these two types of events have ever happened to her. But I wanna hear from her to know if she’s talked to him about it.
I have heard of a conditon in which people do attempt to have sex while they are asleep. It is similar to sleepwalking. But it is usually the “active” participant, in this case, the guy, who is asleep and attempts to have sex with his (suddenly awake) partner. But I think this case isn’t about that. How could he think she was awake? Didn’t he notice that she wasn’t participating very much? (I didn’t read the forum, so I don’t know what she said there.) I would be creeped out, for sure. It would make me wonder if he really thought of me as a person or just a hole in the mattress. I don’t know if I would call this rape, but I would definitely call it weird.
Personally, my husband will often start touching me and arousing me when I am asleep and gently wake me to sex and I love it. But also generally, I will say to him before I go to bed, “hey, feel free to wake me up in the middle of the night if you’re feeling frisky.”
The sex while you are sleeping thing is a little bit weird. The masturbation, not so much. The point is, this breeched your trust. You do say that you felt his apology was genuine, but you are having a hard time getting over it…maybe this is just a deal breaker for you.
You should talk to him and ask him about some of this. Maybe he just gets really horny at night. My husband is a night time love maker, and I am a morning gal—you should discuss this with your boyfriend because maybe he’s really horny at night!
In any case, the situation will never be resolved unless you can have open and honest conversation about it, and communication is key in any relationship. Good luck!
My BF of 3 years often gets frisky in the middle of the night and and we’re in our 50’s! Of course it doesn’t take long for me to wake up and I have to admit it’s very arousing. As far as the masturbating, he probably got horny and was afraid to touch the LW based on the previous episode. They’re in their late 20’s and I know my BF told me when he was that age he was horny a lot more (hard to believe)! Some people just have higher sex drives than others and maybe that’s an issue the LW needs to address. If she’s uncomfortable with what he’s doing she should MOA because it sounds like that’s what he likes to do, but to answer her question, I don’t think it’s weird or rapey, I think he did think she was awake. I honestly don’t see how someone could sleep thru foreplay, let alone sex!
I’m dying to hear from the OP on this one. She posted a few days ago, maybe they’ve talked about it already? If anything, she just needs to talk to him, at the very least. OP, you out there? Do you have any more to add? Any other red flags you didn’t think to mention, or is he really as kind and considerate as you had written? The things he has going for him in my mind are that he apologized the next day and brought it up, which probably means he felt pretty bad about it, and then when you woke up to his masturbating, he put his hand on you. My husband does the same thing when I wake up in the middle of the night as a way to comfort me. For some reason that stuck in my mind as a sweet gesture.
Actually, that reminds me of something I forgot to ask: Did he stop masturbating after he realized you woke up, or did he wait a bit and continue…or was he already finished by the time you woke up. Because if he stopped, that probably means he was embarrassed by it.
This is one of the rare times where I half agree with Wendy. I would def. talk to him about it because it creeped you out but it is not that uncommon and is not too crazy of an event, unless you were blacked out drunk or something and know he took advantage of you. When I first started dating my husband I had sex with him one time. He was talking to me, in charge of everything and it was the best sex we had had yet because he was so relaxed about it. Unfortunately, after he finished he started yawning and blinking and looked at me and said “looks like I slept through a good morning”. He had been sleeping the entire time! I felt so bad because I thought he was awake. He told me it had happened to him before. He’s a deep sleeper who doesn’t remember his dreams. Things like that happen. The masturbating I wouldn’t worry about. He thought you were sleeping and was ready to go but didn’t want the same thing to happen as last time. It would have been more polite for him to get up and go to the bathroom, but he did think you were asleep. Don’t be angry or creeped out unless he was doing something really strange like rubbing it on you after. He probably just has a hire sex drive than you. Not a big deal at all. The condition of sex while your asleep is called sexsomnia and is a real psychological issue for some people.
Seems like the real pattern here is that the BF (probably wakes up and) likes to have sex in the middle of the night. The first time, he thought the LW was into it and awake. When he learned she was not, he was horrified, apologetic and obviously willing to discuss it. Seems like it was an honest mistake, one that several posters have indicated isn’t really an uncommon one. The second time he wanted sex in the middle of the night, he didn’t want to repeat his first mistake and so he took care of it himself. I don’t see anything inherently creepy about that, either.
Sure, the LW should talk to him about it because it obviously makes her uncomfortable and she certainly shouldn’t be uncomfortable sleeping with her boyfriend. But, really, if the issue is that the BF wakes up at 2:00 a.m. with a woody and likes to, ahem, address the issue before he goes back to sleep, I’m not sure how much talking will do to help that. He can suck it up and deal with it in the morning. He can wake her up and they can mutually resolve the situation. He can get up and go to the bathroom and take care of it himself. But, he probably can’t stop himself from waking up horny in the middle of the night. And, if she’s not into middle of the night sex and he’s not keen on midnight treks to the bathroom (or wherever), then this is probably a compatibility issue, not a creeper one.
This was my posting and I wanted to give an update. While my boyfriend is out of town this week, so we can not have a face to face, we did have a good conversation over the phone.
I really think he thought I was awake last week, I have always been able to have conversation and seem pretty aware during sleep. Something like this has never happened with ex boyfriends before so I never considered.
As far as the masturbating in bed next to me this would not have normally bothered me. I think it was just I was still somewhat worried about what had happened before. Last night when we spoke he had no memory of doing this, he was actually horrified I think. I don’t really think he would lie about this. We are really open about talking about sex and the stuff that goes with it. I actually think at this point he could have been asleep while he was masturbating.
We are going to take things slow for awhile but overall I feel much better.
I have not noticed anything else in the relationship that suggest any other red flags.
Good! I’m glad you guys talked, and it seems to have put you more at ease! Obviously keep your eyes open for any red flags. Have you read “The Gift of Fear”? While it’s possible that it could make you paranoid, it also seems to help a lot of people figure out why they’re feeling out of sorts about certain situations if something comes up again that you get freaked out about.
I feel like the masturbating thing could have been that he was half asleep and his hand strayed down and it felt good so he drowsily kept going, if he says he doesn’t remember it. From the way you describe him, it sounds as though he has a somewhat overactive sex drive, and the stress from the first situation led to your unease with the 2nd. I hope everything works out!!! 🙂
Eh, taken alone, along with the fact that she supposedly said she talks in her sleep (edit: which she just now said again in an update right as I was making this post) and I can see how this banging her while asleep could have happened quite innocently… She very well may have responded as if she was very into it… Likewise, as an isolated incident, the midnight masturbation could be explained away as well… But the two together? I dunno. Now the guy is kinda sorta starting to sound like a major weirdo… Yeah, I have a long discussion about this.
Does anyone watch How I Met Your Mother? After you wrote the word “bang” I have the “Bangity Bang” song in my head…damn catchy little ditty!
Yeah, and I also find it weird that he decided to whack off next to her after already having sex that night. I could see if they hadn’t had sex, and he didn’t want to be a creep again, and mistake her being awake, but to already have gotten off, and then need to do it again in the bed right next to his new GF. Go use a bathroom or something!
My 2 cents is that this is a little much ado about nothing. Not that you aren’t entitled to feel weird and ask advice. That is totally justified. But my advice is to tell him you felt uncomfortable with those events and just move on in your happy relationship.
I agree with Dan Savage on this point: once you are in a trusting relationship, sex (of the sort you normally have) is basically assumed to be consensual unless otherwise indicated. Of COURSE people in relationships can be raped; I am not saying that at all — consent can be revoked at basically any time. But the assumption is that sex is consensual.
I’ve been woken up by my (now ex but for other reasons) boyfriend fingering me or having sex with me and I’ve never found it to be creepy – i found it to be either sexy when i was game or “whatever” when I wasn’t (2 year relationship, so there’s a difference there). I’ve woken him up by engaging in sex acts and that was definitely not frowned upon. And my Ex would sleep forever!!! I’d want to hook up and he’d be asleep. I’d wait an hour and he’d STILL be asleep. Eventually, I’d get impatient and jump him, hoping that he’d appreciate my decision to force him to trade sleep for sex. Never once did I (or he) consider this any form of sexual abuse. Maybe a little inconsideration on my part for not letting him get to sleep, which we discussed, but nothing about consent/abuse/rape.
You are TOTALLY justified to be uncomfortable with this and you are totally justified in telling him that. But I don’t think that he’s skeevy for doing it before he knew you were uncomfortable. I really don’t put it as a strike against him. As for the masturbating, I don’t count that against him either. I’ve actually done that before, in the hopes of waking my partner up and having him want to take over or join in. It’s a way of broadcasting to your partner that you clearly are ready for sexy time, if they’re game.
In a healthy committed sexual relationship, I see nothing skeevy about masturbating in the presence of the other person. I see no reason to go and hid in the bathroom. I see no real reason to refrain. In the first couple months of a relationship, you go at it like bunnies. You don’t get a lot of sleep because you were going at it all night. You go to sleep and wake up in the middle of the night and go at it again. This guy respected your uncomfortableness with engaging with you while asleep and he tried a different method of telling you he was interested in sexual activity. This made you uncomfortable which is fair, but he didn’t know it was going to. The violation that you might have felt from having sex without explicit consent is not implicit in seeing him masturbating.
Tell him how you feel. But don’t throw him out over this unless it becomes clear to you that it has something to do with you actually being asleep, as opposed to you and he just being in different moods/places at a given moment.
So something similar happened to me with my ex. It was only a few weeks into us dating, like the LW I believe. I’m also a very deep sleeper (usually don’t wake up during fire alarms) and I talk in my sleep. It happened in the middle of the night, and I remember waking up in the middle of sex, and I was annoyed because I had trouble sleeping at his place and didn’t want to be woken up. But I knew immediately that he had no idea I was asleep at first because I know how I am when I’m asleep, and I knew enough of his character at that point to not question him on it when he apologized for not knowing I was asleep. But I think for the LW if you’re having doubts about the story this early in a relationship, then it’s a bad sign. Because I think if you have to question the story, then it’s probably your intuition telling you it’s an issue. Also coupled with the fact that he was masturbating next to you while you were asleep another night. To me, it does sound like he has a fetish or enjoys that kind of thing.
People do some really odd things in their sleep. At least once my first wife got up, walked to a corner, peed on the carpet and came back to bed. Sex in the middle of the night is loads of fun but if your partner is asleep and your crazy hot for her….well stuff happens. On a few occasions I couldn’t get to sleep without a release or woke up in the middle of the night with a ragging hard on and let my hand do it’s noblest duty. Yes, even when she was asleep next to me, but taking care not to move too much. The problem is that no matter how intimate we are with each other it’s difficult to talk about masturbation in other then the most clinical terms. Ms. FE has caught me more then once and I’ve caught her. Neither of us minds at all, in fact I’m happy that she can get aroused and take care of herself if I’m away or asleep and told her that. She also has my enthusiastic permission to fondle me in the middle of the night.
Oh my god. I am so upset by this thread. I don’t think the sex while sleeping was a big deal, especially considering he apologized genuinely. I also don’t think the masturbating while you’re asleep, either while he’s aware of it or not, is a big deal.
Does this mean I’M creepy? Oh god, maybe I’m creepy. Luckily my husband is a dirty bird and we can be creepy together.
I’m with you. It seems that unwanted male sexuality is ‘creepy.’
Ugly guys who want sex: creepy. Older men who want sex: creepy. Men who masturbate without permission: creepy. etc.
All other issues aside, if I barely knew a guy and he felt the need to jerk off secretly next to my sleeping body after just having sex with me, I’d be concerned.
Here’s the thing, sweetie: if what he did “scared the hell out of you”, why did you voluntarily sleep with him again?
You need to ask yourself that question and honestly confront whatever answer you produce.
OMG, a young man with an insanely high sex drive. That’s the very first documented case in history!!!!!
Women, I’ll let you in on a secret. Young guys masturbate all the time. They want sex, all the time. if you don’t like it, I suggest you either find another gender to be attracted to, or aim your sites at older guys whose testosterone levels have come back down to earth.
The money quote from the letter is: “and he was actually masturbating.”
LOL.
After 70 birthdays I no longer get scores of boners a days but I can rise to the occasion anytime of the day or night with a little encouragement.
The BF doesn’t sound like a total creeper to me from what the LW said. But my experiences have made me see this kind of thing differently. I know a couple of people already mentioned it, but just like sleep-talking/walking, sleep-sex is a real thing. Perhaps the BF or the LW do it without realizing. My fiancé does it, and when we first started dating I went along with it thinking he was wide awake. His eyes were open, he was talking (mostly coherent). Until one day I mentioned the sex from last night and he had no recollection of it. It really freaked him out that he could do all that unconsciously. He asked his exes about it and they confirmed that he had done it for years and they never said anything about it because they thought he was awake. We were in our early 20’s at the time, so I do think it’s possible for the LW and BF to have had a few relationships where this might have been overlooked.
I’m not saying this IS the case, and sure the BF could be a creeper, but it sounds too similar to the sleep-sex I’m familiar with. And after a few years together I’ve actually found myself sleep-sexing as well, and I’ve also gotten much better at identifying when it’s sleep-sex and when it’s awake-sex. LW, I suggest you give your BF the benefit of the doubt and try to find out whether sleep-sex is something either one of you actually does. There’s a good chance it’s you since you already sleep-talk. My fiancé can have whole conversations asleep! If this is the case for you two, I say try to enjoy it! Sleep-sex can be great! Just invest in good protection like the pill, iud, ring, or something like that.
Also, if this is the case, then I don’t think the masturbating is all that weird either. It could be that if you were the sleep-sex initiator you got him all hot and bothered, and then left him high and dry. Honestly, that’s happened to me when my guy initiates sex in his sleep, but he’ll abruptly stop midway through without either of us finishing, and roll over and start snoring. But when you’re awake and on the receiving end, it’s hard to just go back to sleep after that without taking care of business.
I have a sleep disorder – actually it’s a variant of narcolepsy. I masturbate in my sleep. Can’t help it, don’t always do it, but sometimes I do, and I even did it in the sleep lab more than once during testing (which is just about the LEAST erotic place you can imagine). Why do I mention this? Because I TELL my partners about this strange issue when it looks like we’re going to become intimate. That’s important – don’t force your sexuality, in any way, on anyone. TELL your prospective partner what your proclivities are ahead of time, so they can decide, “Yup, fine by me.” or “Nope, that’s a boundary for me.” Sex and intimacy work best when there’s open & honest communication from jump street.
I get a feeling this guy has issues. Might not be the one for you. Peace & good luck.