Your Turn: “He Wants to Take Another Woman to a Wedding”
In a feature I call “Your Turn,” in which you, the readers, get to answer the question, I’m presenting the following letter without commentary from me:
During the time we were trying to be friends he asked if I wanted to go to his friend’s wedding with him Sept. 1st and I said yes. Well, a friend I have known since 6th grade (a girl, mind you) recently asked me if I wanted to go on a free cruise for my birthday to Jamaica. I told her yes. My birthday is Sept. 8th, and the cruise is from the 2nd to the 9th. For me to get to the port in time I would need to leave Sept. 1st, which means I am going to miss the wedding. I feel horrible about it, but at the same time I don’t really know the guy who is getting married and I wanted to do something for my birthday.
I asked Jake and he told me to go on the cruise since it would be good for me. But here’s the problem: Jake wants to take another girl. See, I don’t have a problem with him taking another girl, but should he at least take into consideration my feelings as to who it is going to be? I mean, considering he just told me he wants to be with me and that he is going to prove he means it this time. I know I told him I needed time to make sure he is the best thing for me, but I also wanted him to prove he wanted me, and in my opinion I think his telling me I can’t have my cake and eat it too seems like he still doesn’t care as much as he says he does.
Should I be mad at him for not taking my feelings into consideration or should I just let it go because I did back out of going to the wedding? — Fourth Time’s a Charm?
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Why, exactly, are you two together? I bet if you two broke up, you flirted it up on the cruise, and he took another girl to the wedding, you’d all be a lot happier.
Sigh. Why do you want to be with him after he dumped you? THREE TIMES.
I agree, I can’t figure out why they are together either.
Dump him and never go back again. Life is hard enough without being with someone who only wants you by default.
Because he took it back… Duh! The best thing that could happen to you LW is that he really connects with this girl, and you two go your seperates ways, that way he can string somebody else along, and you can feel happy and free to do whatever you want!
Grow up.
Yeah, seriously. “Take it back”? Does anyone do that after grade school? They both need to grow up and MOA.
There are so many odd flags waving in that letter that it looks like the front of the UN Building.
LW, Sweetie. This guy is a D-Bag, first class. An asshole. There’s no getting around it. He’s stomped all over your heart for far too long. Dump his ass, have a fabulous time on your cruise, and find someone who is unequivocal in his love for you and won’t play these absurd “I love you, I love you not” games.
MOA. Neither of you is ready for a meaningful relationship with each other. He broke up with you 3 times, doesn’t think he is in love with you, although he loves you, and you need time to see if he is the right guy for you. In 3.5 years neither of you is sure and now you are trying to be just friends, but apparently with a lot of strings attached to the other. If this is the state of your relationship after 3.5 years there is nothing there and you are both just insecure about moving on and being single for a while.
I also don’t get the bit about it’s alright for him to go to the wedding with another woman, but you have to pick the other woman. Does your maiden aunt really want to go to a stranger’s wedding that badly, or do you think you know his type so well that you can pick a woman whom he won’t be able to stand to look at?
” I feel horrible about it, but at the same time I don’t really know the guy who is getting married and I wanted to do something for my birthday. ”
Why do you feel horrible about it? Birthday cruise with an old friend >>>>> wedding for someone you don’t know with a guy who’s been wishy-washy at best.
“I don’t have a problem with him taking another girl” .. really? Do you really really not have an issue with this? Do you trust this man? Does your gut feel good about his behaviour? Does it recognize sincerity in his feelings towards you? I learned the hard way that you can’t make yourself love someone, even if they are a friend and there are tons of good reasons to be together. Think about what you really want from a relationship – is this it?
Also how can she say that she doesn’t have a problem with it, but seems outraged that he wants to choose who is going to go with him and not let her pick. If she really didn’t have a problem with it she wouldn’t want to choose who got to go with him. I could see if the girl he picked was an ex girlfriend or something of that nature having a problem with it, but she doesn’t say.
Yes- Women: It is okay to not be okay with something a guy does. If it makes you uncomfortable, own up to it! You need to really be honest with your feelings to have an adult relationship, even if they make you uncool.
PLEASE! The odds of her meeting somebody to BANG and a weeklong, booze drenched cruise are INFINITELY higher than the odds of him hooking up with some other random chick he brings to a wedding… That some here seem to support her odd feelings about this wedding thing is all very strange to me…
I’m not saying that they should stay together- I’m saying that if my husband wanted to take another woman to a wedding I would definitely not be okay with it. I would also not hide that feeling so he doesn’t think I’m lame.
That’s your HUSBAND… Not some guy you are barely dating. Still… would you REALLY care though if your husband took somebody else to a wedding if you were going on a cruise though? Are people REALLY this insecure? I guess so… Most probably. I’m the odd one out here, I suspect.
Perfectly said, lemongrass! Women are conditioned from a very young age to be people pleasers, which is so dangerous in the world of romance. Unfortunately when they start dating, women have to go through a big process of learning to assert themselves, and not all of them are capable of making such a big personality change.
So just because he decides he might be “in love with you” again, you want to give it another try? Instead of worrying about the wedding, stand up for yourself and realize that you have a choice in this matter. You don’t have to go back to him just because he asks you to. You can decide that he hasn’t treated you with the love and respect you deserve, and he doesn’t get another chance. Don’t let him push you back and forth like that whenever he wants. Instead, go on your cruise and have a great time being single. You’ll be so much better off.
MOA. 4th time is not the charm. Don’t be one of those girls that has been on/off with a guy for years and then regrets it when she feels as if she has wasted time and then wants a family. Seen too many of those letters here. People don’t change. MOA, enjoy your cruise and have fun!
You asked: “Should I be mad at him for not taking my feelings into consideration or should I just let it go because I did back out of going to the wedding?”
No, you should not be mad at him, and yes, you should just let it go and MOA.
After 3.5 years, someone should know if they love you. If they love you, they would treat you with respect, dignity and care. They would go out of their way to do things to not hurt your feelings or betray your trust.
This guy doesn’t love you. **IF** he really came around this time and was really in love with you, he would encourage you to go on the cruise, and have fun, and he’d go to the wedding alone, but that’s not what he did. Stop letting this guy string you along, and grow a backbone.
I’m really wondering what kind of a boyfriend thinks it’s okay to take another girl to a wedding. People go to weddings alone all the time, and it’s not that big of a deal. Maybe it’s just me, but that seems really inappropriate to me.
say the person he’s taking as his ‘date’ is just a friend. really it’s that big of a deal to take a friend to a wedding you don’t care about when you’re going on a cruise without him with a friend of your own?
i mean this guy in particular i wouldn’t trust but if he’s never given you a reason to be concerned why would it be that big of a deal to take a friend?
That’s true. I hadn’t really thought about it as the girl being a friend-guest and not a date. In that case, I would be fine with it, but I would want some veto-power if necessary. Like if he picked the friend that had a big crush on him I would probably ask him to find someone else, so I get where the LW is coming from in that regard. But I don’t understand why she would want to just pick someone for him.
Okay, so is he going to get to veto power over every guy she talks to on this weeklong cruise?
Come on, ladies. Some of you are starting to sound like those oddly controlling, Lifetime TV movie psycho boyfriends at the end of the first act… You know, right when Tori Spelling realizes she’s dating an obsessive whackjob… Veto power? Really? And yet, meanwhile, you’re off galavanting the week away on a cruise which, seriously, is hook-up central?
Thanks for the name-calling, but no. I think she should break up with him before the cruise and go alone. The difference between the two is that he’s choosing a date for a wedding. If she went on the cruise while still dating him and guys happened to talk to her, that’s not really something she planned out beforehand. Either way that’s not what I’m saying. They need to break up before any of this happens, but if they choose to stay together then they need to start respecting each other.
One of them is very deliberate while the other is just a normal social interaction.
You seem to miss my point. You really think that if she can’t trust him to go to a wedding with one woman, for one night, he should STILL trust her to go on week long booze drenched cruise? Seriously, the logic here escapes me. Perhaps that’s because there is none? I’m sorry, but this stance is both hilariously one-sided and hypocritical.
I don’t understand why going on a cruise has to involve questionable behavior with other guys. You’re assuming that her vacation is going to be drunken flirting and hook ups, which it might be, but it could also be an innocent vacation with her girlfriend. If she is planning on behaving questionably then I agree with you. Or if she were going on the cruise with a male as a date then I would agree with you. I just don’t see the need to assume that going out will involve anything wrong. It’s really no different than going to bars with a girlfriend and not getting involved with other guys, and not many people get suspicious about that.
It doesn’t. But then why does going to a wedding involve questionable behavior? That’s my point.
That’s a good question. I really haven’t done a good job explaining myself. Serious committed relationships usually try to respect formality some. While the LW’s relationship is clearly not serious or committed (and it shouldn’t even be a “relationship), if they want to start doing better then they need to start behaving differently. The formality of an official “date” is inappropriate to have with another girl, IMO. Part of a committed relationship is showing each other respect, not just in private but in public. I’m hoping someone else can jump in and explain this better than I can, because it’s something I’ve been struggling to verbalize in my own marriage-planning too.
and i’m going to guess that in most of these cases the friend they are taking is a friend from the larger group of friends. so it’s someone you’re going to know. i mean yeah if my husband asked to take a random girl to a wedding i’d probably be a tad concerned. but, if he’s going to a wedding of an old high school or college friend and i can’t go i wouldn’t mind if he took a mutual friend who was probably going to the wedding anyway as a date. but, i think each situation has to be looked at objectively. like i said i doubt this guy is asking to take a date for any reason other than to have a date.
Yeah, the LW’s bf definitely does not have good intentions. I guess I just don’t understand why, if they were in the same group of friends, he would have to have her as a “date” instead of just hanging out with her at the wedding anyway. I don’t care who my fiance talks to, dances with, drinks with, whatever. I’m not jealous. But if he wanted to bring a girl as a “date,” I would laugh at him.
i mean i guess i wouldn’t view it as a ‘date’ in that case. although to be honest i’m pretty sure i will never have to deal with this issue because the few times my husband has been invited to a wedding and i can’t go he views it as a free pass to get to say to no to something he wasn’t all that excited about.
Yeah, it’s not a concern for me either. My fiance loves weddings, but he would never want to take another girl as a date to one because of a public respect for our relationship. I guess that’s my whole point, is that if they want to get serious with each other, they need to respect each other in private and in public.
I agree with this.
In fact – it is a pain in the ass to have a date at a wedding where your date does not know the wedding party or anyone really there. That to me is only something I’d want to do with a girl friend / wife situation and not a casual date…
It’s also way more fun – when single – to be at the wedding stag and I just don’t see situations where you would put up with having to be so attentive to someone you are casually bringing to that event unless there is another motivation…
That’s very true! I also wonder why he wants to open himself up to the gossip that’s going to ensue from taking another girl as a date. That’s only going to result in drama, so unless he’s expecting to get some it’s probably not worth it. Weddings are just a few hours long.
People get so up in arms about the word “date”
People also get up in arms about going to weddings- as if a wedding date is an automatic lay and every man and woman at the end of the night screw each other
I’ve sad this before, but my mom was going to take me as her date to my cousins wedding. Are you all worried we are in an incestuous lesbian relationship? No. Just because we are “dates” does not mean we are automatically romantic… So I see no reason to let a boyfriend/husband go to a wedding with a friend (just typing that makes me feel controlling) even if it’s -gasp- a woman friend. I think if thats an issue there are much deeper relationship issues.
Obviously a mom-daughter date is not the same thing as a man-woman date. People have boundaries and ideas that differ from yours, and it doesn’t mean there’s anything wrong with their relationships, their parenting styles, or any other way they live their lives. If two people in the relationship agree to it then there’s no problem.
I’m sorry, but not “letting” your boyfriend go to a wedding with a friend has nothing to do with boundaries. Not “letting” your boyfriend do anything speaks of insecurity and issues in the relationship. People in relationships don’t own each other. They are each still their own person capable of making their own choices, including making the choice to be friends with (and keep friends who are!) people of the opposite sex.
I didn’t say anything about not having friends of the opposite sex. I said it’s not okay to go on dates with the opposite sex. It’s just respectful. You don’t see many older happily married couples going on dates with the opposite sex even when they’re friends with them. When your relationship goes from casual to serious, you start to change your operations. It’s not necessarily a rule against doing something. There are just some things you should stop doing out of respect for your SO. Before we were engaged, I didn’t _tell_ my fiance what he wasn’t allowed to do. I just watched what he decided on his own was appropriate to do, because it showed me what he thought of our relationship. You know the phrase “Dress for the job you want, not the job you have?” Well, it applies to relationships too. If you want things to go somewhere and work out, then you should start acting that way. Just because you can do something doesn’t mean you should.
Once again, hung up on that word “date”. I guess it used to be the case, but nowadays having a “date” doesn’t mean it’s romantic. It doesn’t mean you are actually dating the person. I go on friend dates. I would absolutely bring a guy to a wedding as call him my date. I would bring my boyfriend and call him my date. My mom would have called me her date if I had gone with her. I guess I get what your saying- when your monogamous, you shouldn’t actively “date” people, but bringing a “date” to a wedding is not that.
I get what you’re saying too. But if we eliminated the word date from this conversation, I still just think that there are some things you should stop doing out of respect for a serious partner. I’m doing all this marriage-planning right now, and an easy example that I ran across was going to dinner with your best guy friend. It’s okay to do that when you’re dating more casually, but when you get serious it might be better to invite the SO along, have dinner as a bigger group of friends, or do something that looks less romantic from the outside, like shopping or a football game together. It’s partly about appearances. Other people see you doing those things and don’t necessarily know what’s going on, which can reflect poorly on your relationship and your SO. People start to gossip, and people start to feel sorry for the SO who was left at home. It shouldn’t be that way, but since it is, it’s something to consider when making decisions about the boundaries you set with other people. I would never want my future husband to have to endure someone telling him I was at dinner with someone else as if they felt sorry for him, and I would never want him to start to wonder about it himself, ya know. Perhaps this is something that’s a big deal to me because I come from a small town where the only thing to do is gossip, but to me it just seems like basic decency to a serious partner.
Yeah this is a personal thing not something that everyone feels. My husband goes to dinner with his friends and I go to dinner with my friends. In fact last week I went to dinner alone with two men neither of who were my husband. Nothing in a relationship should be about appearances. It should be about you and your SO communicating together what is appropriate for you. There is a large difference between having friends who you do things with vs. having inappropriate relations with someone. And who really cares if people talk if you and your partner are happy. Because honestly people are always going to find something to talk about especially in a small town. You can’t go through life walking on egg shells.
Right. I was saying that it’s a personal thing. Katie was the one that said that there must be something wrong with anyone who has a relationship that operates that way. If other people want to do that then that’s their business.
To many people the lines that they agree on in their relationship reflect what other people are going to say or think, and that’s totally fine if both of them are okay with that.
yea, you need to have a relationship where if someone were to say, oh your wife was with some guy at dinner is she cheating on you? your husband would go oh god no thats bob her best friend. they have been friends forever. he is awesome they go out to dinner all the time. and thats it. that is a relationship that is built on trust and honesty.
and if it is about appearances for you, then im sorry you live in a part of the country that operates in that way… i have never once thought what my actions would “look like” to other people- i just, like, do what i want to, you know? so if i want to go to dinner with my best guy friend, i tell my boyfriend and then i go. i have literally never once thought, oh maybe i shouldnt go see my good friend- people might think im cheating. i cant imagine thinking that way.
Yeah I don’t know basing lines in your relationship on what others may think or say is kind of a dangerous thing to do. People are always going to find something to comment on, and you could run around in circles trying to change the lines in order to keep people from commenting. It should be about what the two of you find acceptable and who cares what other people think. Eventually I would think the appearances in your relationship would be more important than the relationship itself.
@katie, Don’t feel sorry for me. It’s what I’m happy with. I’m happy to be with someone who doesn’t want to put me in an awkward situation, and I’m happy to do the same for him. It’s not odd or limiting to either of us. We don’t follow the rules strictly either. We just do what we’re personally comfortable with, and neither one of us would be comfortable with having a person of the opposite sex accompany us to a wedding. We have dinners with other people, and we’ve faced criticism for it. We’ve been advised against it over and over again, and our operations will probably shift some when we get married.
@jlyfsh, We pick and choose what we want to take and what we don’t want to. We’re not overly concerned with appearances, but it is something that we talk about. I don’t know if you read or remember my forum thread several months ago about how he went to a strip club with some of his female friends and then stayed the night with them (because he was out of town and drunk), but that was an appearances issue. I knew he wasn’t cheating, but it was an inappropriate series of events, and other people came to me with concern about it. It was humiliating for me, and I was furious. We had conversations about it, decided what was okay for us, and moved on from it. It doesn’t have to control your life to acknowledge it sometimes.
I should also say that we’re both a little old-fashioned when it comes to our relationship. He opens the car door for me, and I do various little things for him. It works for us. It doesn’t work for everyone, and I respect that. I’m just admittedly very tired of having my personal decisions under attack from people who claim to be progressive and feminist.
well, i will say that the keeping up of appearances is a very, very southern thing. ive seen that sterotype played out on tv a whole lot, so i guess its true.
i just cant imagine living that way. being actually afraid that if i was with a man who isnt my boyfriend/husband, i would face critism. it seems very middle east/anti-woman/ect… and i mean i guess you say your fiance gets it too, so it cant be anti-woman, so then it just seems archaic.
and i agree with jlyfsh, if all you care about is what people think, you will lose sight of what you actually care about and what is actually important.
I agree that if that’s all someone cared about they would end up with serious relationship problems, but that’s an extreme view of this. I’m not saying that’s what we do, nor am I advocating that anyone should do that. It’s an occasional thing that you pick and choose what’s important to you. It’s important to me that people don’t see him going home with his female friends from a strip club, and it’s also important to me that people don’t see me out alone at a bar or sleeping over with a guy friend unless my SO is there with me. He goes to lunch with other girls all the time, and I don’t care. I dance with other guys, and he doesn’t care. People talk about both. You just decide what your own boundaries are, and you consider what you’re okay with people speculating on and what you’re not okay with. It’s not that complicated or that different from how other relationships operate. Just another thing to draw boundaries and make decisions about together.
And as far as culture goes, it’s really not just a relationship issue. It’s embedded in employment, club membership, etc. He’s about to join the Masons since all the men in my family are Masons (I know, I know…), and at least in our local lodges, they wouldn’t take him if he had a reputation for stepping out on me or doing anything questionable in his relationship. And joining the Masons is also a networking thing for his job since a good portion of Southern lawyers are Masons. It’s all very much full circle here. Even if it’s not important to someone personally, gossip will probably still affect them.
i cant believe it has such far reaching ties… thats crazy.
i guess i just want to live in a world where everyone can do what they wish without worrying about those kinds of things- so like your boyfriend could go with his girlfriends to a strip club and as long as you knew and were comfortable that was that- no one would judge anyone for that. i have worked so hard to have that right in my own life that it makes me sad to know that others dont have that.
I honestly have no idea what it would be like to not have to think about that sort of thing. You can certainly make the decision to not _care_ about what other people think, but as I said, it deeply affects most aspects of your life regardless of whether or not you want it to. Relationships with in-laws, reputation for getting a loan, being a scout leader, roles in church, employment, promotions, political action in your town, parties you’re invited to, networking you’re able to do, business you’re able to generate, etc. It’s kind of endless. People won’t even support your business if they don’t believe you’re a good person. You can put a stop to it in your immediate friend and family groups, but it can’t stop completely. I suffered some horrible consequences for the few wild and crazy teenage years when I decided I didn’t care what anyone thought, and I’m still repairing the damage from it. Of course everyone does stupid stuff at that age, but it doesn’t really go away here. I hope to run for public office one day, and I have to worry about the stuff that happened when I was 17, half of which wasn’t even true. He’s starting his own law firm, and his business depends partially on the way we carry ourselves.
People are going to talk about you until the day that you die, but I’m making a conscious decision that I want to have a reputation as an upstanding citizen from here on out. I want people to trust me, and US as a couple, and it’s all inseparable. Having a good reputation takes work. Having a bad one can sometimes only take doing what you want to do without grooming some appearances.
not gonna lie, that sounds absolutely awful. i mean it sounds like living in the 1950’s! dang.
well, good luck i guess! haha
Different strokes for different folks. I like it a lot. Living in that sort of an environment makes people more accountable for what they’re doing. It’s part of why Southerners are so stereotypically nice all the time and why we have such a strong community with each other. I think it fosters a lot of “good” people and fewer people who are selfish, conniving, or dangerous.
Anyway, I’ll shut up about it now.
it also fosters a lot of people who are only concerned about looking good. at least in my experience of growing up and living in the south. and just as many bad, selfish, conniving dangerous people come from the south. just as many as anywhere else, you just don’t realize it because on the outside they are so damn pleasant.
Hold on. “If he loves you, he’d encourage you to go on the cruise and he’d go to the wedding alone”? Sorry, but that’s just ridiculous. How about making her show a little responsibility too? By your logic, the exact opposite point is true: if SHE loves HIM, she would have simply turned down the cruise because she had a prior commitment (or tried to catch an early flight out on the 2nd) and come to the wedding. After all, she already promised to be there. And short of a family emergency or a health crisis, it’s just irresponsible to do this. I mean, I love my wife very much, but I’d be offended if she had committed to being my date to a wedding and then blew it off for a cruise right before the date, and I would have been only slightly more offended now that we’re married than I would have when we were dating. If there’s a legitimate emergency, then bail on the wedding. But a cruise isn’t an emergency, so absent trying to juggle both of them — which, unless it’s across the country from one another, I believe could be done — she could at least make an appearance at the wedding.
So if she blows the wedding off, no, she absolutely gets zero say in who he brings. Put on your big girl panties, LW, and grow the hell up. This isn’t grade school. It’s a date to a wedding, not a permission slip for the guy to have sex. Bringing a date to a wedding is COMPLETELY different than banging his date at a wedding, and if your issue is with the latter, you need to clarify that it’s the latter. But if you have a problem with him doing that, then turnabout is fair play, and you can’t get all flirty or hook up with a guy on the cruise. What’s good for the goose is good for the gander, so to speak.
Relationships aren’t scoreboards, and they aren’t games, and if what you want is a game, just go your separate ways. But Jesus, LW, do you recognize how childish and immature and pathetic you sound in this letter? I mean, I pretty much NEVER rip into LWs, but I need to make an exception here, because this is just ridiculous. The fact that you even had to ask whether it’s OK for you to have veto power over the date your semi-boyfriend brings to a wedding that you committed to and then blew off . . . I mean, I can’t even put into words how hard I’m shaking my head right now. If you have such a big issue with him going with anyone else to the wedding, JUST GO TO THE DAMN WEDDING.
Wow, I don’t think I’ve ever disagreed with you, Guy Friday. If my fiance had an opportunity to go on a FREE CRUISE (come on, that’s an awesome deal!), I would be practically pushing him onto the ship regardless of what our afternoon plans were. I’d think that a person would want their SO to have lots of (appropriate) fun for a full week instead of just for a few hours. It’s an awesome opportunity for her that might never come along again, so I think it would be selfish for him to want to keep her home for the wedding.
And then you have to question why this friend is conveniently paying for this cruise around the time she is supposed to be at a wedding with a guy that has treated her like garbage…
I assumed the friend won the cruise or something. The LW didn’t really give us any details about it other than it was free to her. But you’re so right. That’s the exact sort of thing a lot of people would do to make their friends realize that they need to make themselves single.
BRILLIANT!!
C’mon Budj. Don’t be so skeptical. And why hasn’t there been an Underwater Tiger fan cruise yet?
haha – I’m a pessimist 🙁
Let us land some sort of record contract first – baby steps.
I stand by what I said. If a friend offered to take me on a free cruise for my birthday my husband would 100% encourage me to go, and he would want me to have a great time, even if it meant missing something like his friend’s wedding.
I’m so sorry honey, but he’s not In love with you. He keeps taking you back because he doesn’t want to be alone. Stay single and find someone who really does appreciate you. You deserve it!
Wendy had some awesome advice the other day about not worrying whether a guy likes you but instead wonder if he is treating you the way you want to be treated. Don’t waste your time pondering whether the guy is actually in love with you this time. It is not worth your time. He is treating you like crap.
The best thing you can do is move on from this crappy shred of a relationship. Enjoy the cruise and stop worrying about who else he is going to the wedding with.
Short term: No, you shouldn’t be mad at him. You backed out of the wedding and especially if he already RSVPed, it’s rude of him not to bring a guest if he said he would.
Long term: Why do you want to be in a relationship with no trust? That’s what your question about the wedding really boils down to because if you trusted him, then you wouldn’t care who he went with because you’d be secure in your relationship and trust that he wouldn’t do anything he shouldn’t at this wedding. I don’t blame you for the lack of trust with all the break ups, and the I love you and “taking it back” (what is that!! If you truly love someone you can’t take it back!!). I’d suggest you work on your self confidence…yes, spend time with friends. Go on the cruise. Work out. Join an IM sports team or book club. If you built yourself up a bit more, I think you may realize that this guy is just not worth it.
Yeah, I was going to say something about the wedding, but I didn’t it to mask the fact that the guy is a jerk. I know it’s a wedding of someone she doesn’t know versus a cruise for her birthday, but I’m not a big fan of backing out of things when you commit to them. Weddings are one of those things where it often does matter if you’ve said you’re going or not. And if he were a normal guy, I would raise an eyebrow at her ditching him. But he’s not, so it doesn’t really matter.
Setting the other issues aside, he did RSVP for 2 and to waste the catering fee is just plain rude. We put on a good shindig at our wedding and a few that did RSVP didn’t show. I was disappointed but they were co-workers so I kept my mouth shut. We got a really nice gift from them so it wasn’t a total loss and there were more leftovers for us. Still I would have liked to shared our day with them.
I really hope this LW is very young (as in, this was mainly an on-again/off-again high school relationship), but the cruise thing makes me think she must be at least a bit older.
While I don’t want to be unsympathetic, the truth is that I am just at my wit’s end with these LWs who let boyfriends treat them like crap and/or doormats! What is wrong with everyone?! Why is it not 100% obvious that if a guy says “I am not in love with you,” you shouldn’t be dating him?!
I’ve got plenty of my own issues with self esteem, and I’ve stayed in relationships past the point that it was healthy/beneficial. We’ve all made mistakes that may now seem obvious or avoidable in retrospect. But that said, wow, this latest batch of LWs is killing me! Have some self-respect and try to remember that being single is NOT the worst thing in the world — it’s far far better than being with an inconsiderate and selfish dude like this!
I guess I kind of ignored the actual question… but the wedding issue just seems to be the least of her problems.
Hit the nail on the head with this gem.
WDS
My first WDS! Totally makes up for the fact that this LW has me pulling my hair out!! 🙂
WDS! Seriously, what is wrong with being single?! I just want to take these women by the shoulders, shake them and demand, “WHAT?!?! WHAT DO YOU THINK IS GOING TO HAPPEN IF YOU ARE SINGLE?!?!” I watch a few of the women in my life chase after these shitty, shitty partners they don’t even care that much about. Unattractive, assholes, players, losers, and they’re chasing these guys, allowing themselves to be used and treated terribly, and then dropped when they get to be too much trouble only to be picked back up by the douche in question when he decides he’d like sex on the regular again. Choosing to be single doesn’t even occur to them. And when they are actually single, they’re trying so desperately not to be that they never actually enjoy being single, so of course they think they don’t like being single. It’s such an infuriating cycle to watch.
WDS and WPLS
I totally agree, painted lady. I probably wouldn’t have 6 months ago but all of my prior experience being single was when I lived with my parents so no wonder it was lame. My first time being single as an adult is awesome! It’s not worth compromising for just any guy, especially a douche like the LW’s boyfriend who falls in love with her every time his dick gets hard and when it’s soft again his “feelings” are gone.
Agreed!
I want a family… so that was the only scary part about being single in my late 20’s. I was just a little afraid of the little ticking clock. Other than that?? Being single was ridiculously fun!!!! Nobody cares where you go or when you go there! Your schedule is totally your own. You get to flirt with whoever you want. My social life was NEVER better then when I was 28/29 and single. It was so much fun. Of course, it would have been a little sad if that continued on for the rest of my life. Eventually, you want to know that someone cares where you are and when you are coming home. But, singlehood can be amazing.
LW… go out and experience it… starting with this cruise.
I’m so happy you’re happy, Anna. 🙂
A-men.
Yay, Daisy! Spot-on.
Unfortunately, it takes some of us a long time to realize something isn’t right for us. I stayed with a man almost 4 years who repeatedly treated me like garbage. Looking back, I was such a fool! And, really… so was he. Because we were both miserable. I would break up with him because he lied to me, emotionally abused me, etc. etc… he said he loved me and would change, bla bla, I went back. It was a stupid cycle that made us both just pathetic and sad.
I wish I could somehow allow some of these LWs to experience a GOOD relationship for even a day. They would see these bad, wishy-washy, miserable, immature relationships are just NOT WORTH IT.
Trust me LWs! There are better relationships to be had!
Besides the obvious that this guy is a dope….I just wanted to comment on this line:
“I know I told him I needed time to make sure he is the best thing for me, but I also wanted him to prove he wanted me, and in my opinion I think his telling me I can’t have my cake and eat it too seems like he still doesn’t care as much as he says he does.”
Don’t have hidden meanings. If you wanted him to prove it you should have said that. NOT THAT IT would have made a difference with this guy – but with the next one – say what you want and mean what you say and pay attention to your gut when there is weird behavior on the dude’s end because this guy is a flake and not committed. I wouldn’t be surprised to find out he is feeding you lines when he wants to get laid – the fact that he is inviting another girl to this wedding when he “wants to be with you” is a huge red flag, imo.
Ugh, yeah. This guy sucks, but she is playing games to get him to prove his love and that really is unacceptable. GROW UP EVERYONE.
Honestly, after reading this letter, I can see WHY he just isn’t that into her. So much game playing on her end. I’d run for the door screaming.
LW– if you need somebody to “prove themselves” before you decide that you’d like to make a relationship work, then the relationship is already broken. And it is. He’s dumped you 3 times already & isn’t sure whether he’s in love with you or not. You sound young, so I’m going to say three & a half years is a LONG time to spend with somebody who’s not even certain that he loves/want to be with you!
Please think about this. You want to give him one last chance or something, & have him finally put your feelings first & prove he loves you, right? But expecting grand gestures is a set-up for disappointment. Especially when the gesture is something like “I’ll let you weigh in on who I’m allowed to take as a wedding date.” THAT’S how he’s going to “prove himself to you”? Set the bar higher– and not for him, but for yourself. Have fun on the cruise & make sure to break up with this guy before you go.
YES! as someone wrote the other day… STANDARDS – THEY NEED TO BE HIGHER 🙂
If her attitude is that she has to have her cake and eat it to in a relationship, then that may be why the guy has been so on-again, off-again. I just don’t think either is really into this relationship and that this LW has something of a princess complex.
If I follow correctly, you and your boyfriend are currently “on” – not just as friends but as lovahs, exclusive lovahs, I assume. You are opting for a free cruise on your birthday over rubber chicken (or a potluck?) at a wedding for a couple you don’t know. So far I’m 100% with you. (Well, I’m not 100% against you.) Your boyfriend doesn’t seem to mind. (Lucky you!) Your boyfriend found a friend to take your place. (Lucky you!) She’s a girl. (A lot of people are!) There are two things you should be worrying about: 1) When are you going to get a bikini wax? (I personally would schedule it for a day or two before departure, but that’s just me.) 2) How will you sneak alcohol onto the ship? (You really need to find a way because the cruise won’t feel so “free” when you get your drink bill.) I hope I answered all of your questions. Have fun!
Not a potluck wedding!!! We all know that is like the worst thing anyone could possibly do!
Can we talk about how much bikini waxes hurt? Because I knew it was going to hurt when I got one, but I didn’t know that it would hurt THAT MUCH.
YES! I remember going for the first time, trying to be all brave & act like it was no big deal, but there sure was a little tear in the corner of my eye that I had to fight back the whole time!
Oh that makes me sad! I’ve finally found a place that doesn’t seem totally gross to get a bikini wax done! Is it that bad? Like will a glass of wine cure it?
yes it was that bad. Horrible. I mean I’ve gotten my eyebrows waxed a bazillion times, and I’m pretty stoic about pain. But I don’t know if I’ll ever get a brazillian again.
Wow. Y’all are talking me out of this real quick.
I’ve never gotten a full Brazilian, but just a regular Bikini wax is NOT that bad. I mean, it sucks, but it’s over in 10 minutes
Yeah, i’ve had the touch up wax done. but was thnking of taking the plunge…hmmm.
Honestly, do it once. I’ve heard of ladies who have no issues with waxing. So at least try it. It might be perfect for you!
brazillian versus a regular trim waxing are much different experiences… inside skin versus outside skin. Just saying. I get a standard no peekers out of my bikini version and it hurts but not crazy… plus the brazillian freaks me out because I really don’t want to look prepubescent, and it gets a little chilly.
thus concludes my nonrelated TMI tangent 🙂
Oh dear god. Waxing and tattoos are the worst pains I have experienced in my life so far. Seriously. They hurt So. Fucking. Much.
The worst pain I ever experienced was after knee surgery when it felt like the only thing connecting my lower leg to my upper leg was staples. Except it didn’t just feel that way; there were over a dozen staples on my knee. At one point I thought I’d get up by myself to go use the bathroom except the pain was so much that I passed out on the floor but I didn’t land well and I pulled out a couple staples. … But I didn’t feel the pain of the fall because I was already passed out. I didn’t feel the pain of the fall until I woke up. But then then pain was so much I passed out. ..
But yea bikini waxes suck. And the truth is I only get them at the beginning of relationships, haha.
The worst pain I had was a dislocated knee-cap in ballet. Then migraines. Then brazillian wax.
Ok, here are mine, in order of pain:
1. Knee surgery,
2. Wisdom teeth,
3. Bikini waxes,
4. Those little zits right on your lip line and the ones right in your nostril, know what i mean?
Hmm.. I think mine would go
1. Tattoo- my tatto is big and on my ribs though, which is a terrible spot to get tattooed
2. Waxing
3. The first night after wisdom teeth when my medication wore off as I was sleeping. That pain was intense but short lived. I had nice pain pills for all my downtime. I actually got high from them when I took it and I didn’t need it for the pain anymore. I can totally see how people take those recreationally/ get addicted to them.
omg the pimples right on your lip are the worst!!!
Hmmmm….childbirth. Nuff said. 🙂
electrolysis on your upper lip. not only is it crazy painful but you dont’ realize how connected all the nerve ending are until you are crying and sneezing at the same time!
I’ve done that. It is a bitch. It goes on my list as the new No. 3.
Ooh, ooh I wanna play, too….
1. ACL reconstructive surgery
2. Getting my front tooth knocked out playing hockey and not being able to go to the dentist until the next morning
3. Reading the typical DW Your Turn letter
Dennis, I’ve had THREE ACL reconstructive surgeries. As in three times. Soccer, tear ACL, reconstructive surgery, rehab. Run, tear ACL, reconstructive surgery, rehab. Play drunk soccer on a beach, tear ACL, reconstructive surgery, rehab. …
I dunno, I kind of want you to go “oooh, ahhhh” and be impressed.
Yikes. I’d say more aghast than impressed….
Where are you getting all these spare ACLs, anyway? With two patellas and two hamstrings, I’m counting that you’re down to one tendon left to transplant. Unless… ew, you’re getting them from dead people.
AP runs with dead people!
First one, patella. Second surgery, hamstring — and I advise AGAINST using the hamstring. Third, DEAD PEOPLE. Honestly, if I had to do it all over again – well, if I had to do all 3 over again, I’d start with a cadavar. Recovery was a hell of a lot faster than using my hamstring, and, well, obviously my own tissue is prone to tear, so why not use somebody else’s?
My worst was getting an IUD put in. It made me seriously wonder how anyone could have a baby without pain medicine.
FUCK YES on IUD pain. Holy hell why does no one warn you of that?!?
Ah I’m scared to get an iud. Maybe that’s why I haven’t really put effort in to getting one. That and it’s really expensive for me
I didn’t think it hurt that badly… Am I weird? It wasn’t fun, but it wasn’t that bad.
Mine wasn’t that bad either- like a brief, awful cramp.
@theenemy
I know absolutely nothing about the pain involved in inserting an IUD………but your name makes me laugh every time I see it.
Also, I wish I knew someone who (1) gave birth *and* (2) had ACL reconstructive surgery because — I’m sorry in advance — there is NO WAY anything can be worse than ACL reconstructive surgery.
But someone who has had both, please speak up!
Me too!
1. Wisdom teeth (pain meds stopped working after 3 days.)
2. Broken tailbone
3. Compressed spine
For all of you thinking wisdom teeth was painful – I had mine done a year after having my tonsils removed… it was a spring breeze compared to the tonsils. Having to swallow the pain meds when you medically really can’t swallow made me want to become a needle addict. Didn’t even take my meds with my wisdom teeth!
I would say:
1a. Dislocating my elbow and dealing with the reconstructive surgery, risk of my arm growing wrong, and the rehab. I was 5… strongest thing they could give me was super childrens Tylenol. At least injury as an adult involves opiates.
1b. Tearing my ACL and then dealing with the consequences of partying/dancing that night (there was lots of nonprescription medication involved, hence platforms and dancing 4 hours after I was carried off a field). never had the surgery though, just did rehab
2. Tonsils
3. Lip electrolysis
yeah i had my 9 year/12 year some molars in front of my wisdom teeth straightened out and exposed above the gum line using braided wire. basically they yanked it straight and then up. then they proceeded to remove my impacted wisdom teeth. i had braces at the time. luckily it was when i was 12. i don’t think i would have handled that as well as an adult!!
i’ve also fallen down a flight of stairs and broken my arm on the second to last step. if my elbow hadn’t hit i would have walked away with only a bruised knee!
and i also had my other wrist rolled over by my friend’s father when roller skating. we were goofing around. it wasn’t his fault, he tried to stop.
i also once cut my eye on a piece of paper. don’t ask me how i did this. but i ended up with a crazy infection and had to wear glasses for months (i was in college and having to wear glasses is like the worst possible thing ever, right? oi) and put these awful drops in my eyes.
and then the ovarian cyst with torsion is at the top of the list. i puked so many times that day because of pain. and actually my belly button recovery from that surgery was kind of painful because i developed a yeast infection that i couldn’t get rid of and my belly button oozed constantly while they tried to clear the infection up.
Hands down, double jaw surgery. Since I’m still going through the pain, I can’t imagine anything worse. Every day it’s a stabbing pain followed by a “wait, is my face still in one piece?” moment followed by more stabbing pain and then what can only be described as a face wide brain-freeze.
I hate bikini waxes and they hurt like hell, but I would rather get one on the regular than go through this pain. I’m sure I’ll change my mind after childbirth, but until then, this is it.
No one has mentioned UTIs! Motherfucker…that’s the worst pain I’ve ever had in my life.
So much so that in remembering it I could even think about adding anything else. Nothing even comes close….but I haven’t given birth or had surgery, so that’s probably why. If I were to add more:
2. Wisdom teeth maybe? I remember it being more supremely uncomfortable than painful though
3. Getting needles in your gums at the dentist
Brazilians would be pretty far down my list….they definitely hurt but it’s over pretty quick.
I tried to do it myself at home (worst idea ever) Not only was it more painful than natural childbirth, but it left my skin neon pink with purple polka dot bruises for a week!
So- should I go get a brazilian to prepare myself for natural childbirth? Wendy- what do you think? If she doesn’t answer here maybe I should write in about this.
Just go for the epidural! With my first I was trying to go all natural because all the books I read made it seem like the epidural would slow labor, affect breastfeeding, etc…ended up getting one and it actually kept me from needing a C section. With the twins I had to have one from the beginning and was a great experience. I barely had pain at all
The epidural freaked me out too much, I went with a natural birth both times (and the babies were BIG).
The idea of someone messing with my spine kept me from getting an epidural. I’d rather have no pain medication than risk someone messing up my spine or getting an infection in it. I went natural both times too and it was okay. It is intense but it does end and then you have a beautiful baby. I think everyone has to do what works for them. I have a friend who feels guilty for getting an epidural after being in labor for 24 hours and then needing a c-section. I told her none of us would get a c-section without pain medication and she shouldn’t feel bad about it.
Yeah, I definitely don’t judge women who get epidurals, especially since I haven’t been there yet and don’t know what the pain is like but the thought of an epidural is more scary to me than childbirth.
Get lasered! Never have to wax again! Although lasering did hurt a bit too, but nothing like waxing!
I’ve heard lasering hurt more!!! Guess it depends on your skin/hair type/etc. – a friend is very pleased with her treatments but phrases like “ice pack to the crotch” are involved. Though if anything was permanent I might be willing to suck it up
For me it was like getting a tattoo- It hurt while they were actually lasering, but as soon as they stopped the pain stopped. It’s SOOOO worth it to never ever again have razor burn/red bumps on my bikini line!!
How many sessions did you have to do before all the hair was gone? I am sooo thinking about doing this.
I think I did 6-8 on my bikini area?? I forget how many. You start seeing results right away, too.
I still have a few random hairs that pop up every now and then, but I’d say overall there has been about a 98-99% reduction in hair. It’s glorious.
Also, the place I went to was VERY flexible on the price. I bartered with them (by accident), and got bikini and underarms for $1000.
Barter on everything! Except for groceries but damn near every store has a discount program set up- use it! It’s so easy- just say “I’d really like this- but it’s the price I’m not so sure about. Is there any way you can give me a better deal?” They say “no, not really.” Then you say “Oh. Such and such a store was going to give me it at X price but I’d rather get it here, I like this store better.”
WHAM, discount. Also, be polite. Assholes don’t get discounts.
I was actually trying to get them off my back, and was like, “listen, I really can’t afford to spend more than $1000- sorry” and she was like “let me talk to the manager”– BAM!! Done! I was psyched!
@ bethany: good info, thanks. friend did mention that the redness, etc. afterwards was way better than with waxing. This may be my new project after my wedding… plus then it doesn’t seem like I’m getting cleaned up just for my wedding night 😉
Am I the only one that just relies on shaving? Is that crazy? I am just really cheap… so it would kill me to have someone remove hair that I can remove myself. I’ve gotten no complaints about my lady business.
Nope, I also rely only on shaving. I like to spend as little time as possible grooming myself, & shaving gets the job done quicker. Making an appointment, going to the appointment, etc. is too much for me! (Shaving is super annoying though, which is why laser seems like a good alternative. A few sessions & then never needing to shave again? sounds glorious)
I do! But I hate doing it so thats why I’m looking into waxing. I’ve had no complaints either, but those 3 of 4 minutes in the shower are such a drag to me.
You’re not the only one! I don’t see the sense in waxing – the pain, the cost, the maintenance. Making an appointment to have hair removed when I can do it myself in my bathtub? WTF? I’ll pay someone else to change my oil, because I’m too lazy to do it myself. But not to de-hair me.
Then again, I’m a really low-maintenance person with most personal grooming so I let my hair go perhaps a little longer than most women do. I don’t see body hair as gross and don’t worry about removing it until it becomes unsightly – that goes for legs, armpits and bikini area. Luckily my hair grows in light so I can get away with this. My husband is also thankfully quite tolerant of it, though he will sometimes tease and very rarely complain if I’ve gotten a little too “jungly.”
And you know what … even if someone sees me with unshaven legs, why the f*ck should I care? What’s gonna happen, they’ll think of me as unfeminine? “Oh noes…” If I had a magic wand I’d zap away the societal standards for body hair on women and free us all from the tyranny of removing it regularly!
FWIW: Pale, pale skin + dark, course hair = waxing is better in some instances because even when you shave you can still see the dark hair follicles and it looks like you need to still shave!
I wish I could shave. Shaving hurts me so badly, and my hair grows back as I get out of the tub.
Then again, waxing hurts a ton and also doesn’t last. So really I’m just hairy almost all the time. I have a No-No now and it’s helping a little, but hair removal is hell for me.
Ooooh! I want the no-no! How is it? Does it last longer than shaving/waxing? Do you feel anything?
What’s a No-No?
It’s a new electronic hair removal device that’s supposed to be permanent….if you can managet to keep doing it for at least 5-6 weeks. It sounds like a bit of a time investment, but worth it in the end if really is permanent. It’s supposed to be painless, but I wonder about that!
My hair is still there, and it still grows fast, but it is MUCH thinner. And I will admit shaving doesn’t hurt as much now. And I don’t get ingrown hairsfavorable burn so much anymore. So all in all, I don’t know if it takes away hair forever, but it definitely helps.
I’ve read you’re supposed to empty a thing of mouthwash, put vodka in it and then use dye to turn it the color of the mouthwash that was originally in the bottle. But, do people really do that? I just bought drinks off the ship….And at the captain’s dinner thing when they gave out free champagne I drank like 2 bottles worth.
Oh my god. Do not give alcoholics any tips!! I mean that is a really smart idea. But I just imagine cough cough people I know doing that just on a Tuesday morning. It’s so brilliant it’s sick.
haha i’ll try not to do that anymore. i am way way too much of a worrier (i googled that word and it still looks wrong) to ever attempt anything like that! all i could think about it being hauled off to cruise jail (is there a jail on a cruise ship??) until they could hand me over to the authorities. which i’m sure is not what would happen, they would just take it away, but yeah i could never actually go through with something like that!
The brig! Yarr matey.
Damnit jlyfsh. I needed this advice 2 years ago when I went on a cruise.
I’m going to say something really controversial that may cause a lot of people to judge me but what the hell I’m feeling bold this morning: I FUCKING LOVE CRUISES. Big ass crusie ships full of couples from Ohio and Iowa (is amazing how many there are!) , with organized activities and all-you-can-eat buffets …. There, I said it. I love it.
And all you judgers, I used to be a judger too. (“What, a cruise? That’s so lame. I like to do cultured things when I’m on vacation!”) Then I went on a cruise… F’ cultured vacations! Crusises rock! In my case, I slept like a baby, read a 1,000+ page book, laid out 12 hours a day, drank my weight in bahama mamas, and talked to a new couple from Ohio or Iowa every day. It was blissful.
NO JUDGMENT HERE! I aspire one day to be a cruiser… because I love nature & wildlife, but from a distance not being in it all hikey and campey like (I’m allergic and accident-prone which can be a bad combo in the great outdoors), so I figure that that cruising to Alaska and places like that gives me my nature as a vista while I’m in the comfort of a lounge chair. I have similar thoughts about train travel… take one of those old school lines and see country instead of flying over it!
I’ve never been on a cruise. I want to so badly. Because even when I go to cool places like the dominican republic or costa rica…I just end up drinking on the beach all day anyway! So why not do that on a cruise and not even have to pretend like I care about anything but pool and booze. And food – mass quantities of food.
OMG- IWTTS, you gave me the greatest idea.
DW cruise. Pick one cruise line, destination, ship, etc. and everybody finds their own transportation there. Then it’s like a meetup, only with more vacation and tan lines.
Could you imagine the margaritas???
Oh god. My liver just curled up and hid with that comment. But obviously I’m down, it will just have to sack up and quit being such a baby.
Cirrhosis is for pussies. DW vacation 2013!!!!
Omg. This HAS to happen. MUST HAPPEN
I’m in!!!
Yes but can we wait till like the end of 2013 when my baby doesn’t need my boob. I want to get sloppy.
Oh.my.gahhd, this would be seriously amazing!
LOVE this!!! I’d be soooo in!
This is possibly the best idea ever.
IN
They have specific bottles for sneaking booze on a cruise. A friend and his family did a reunion cruise thing and took a bunch on.
We did that at Spring break– We put Captain Morgan in a listerene bottle. (the brown kind of listerene)
“Lovahs” made me grin. So thanks for that.
Regarding drinks on cruise ships, I had a friend who put vodka, rum and tequila in wine bottles and re-corked them. Apparently each guest is allowed to bring a bottle of wine now, so that’s what they did. I thought it was genius.
It is. Although my first thought, was EWWW, who would mix those things together with wine?
Put alcohol in a white mouthwash bottle that you can’t see through. Then pack it deep into your checked bag. That’s what one of my cruisemates did earlier this summer!
Please tell me you are like 21 years old?
He is stringing you along, dating you when it works for him, with no regard for your feelings. Break up with him once and for all and go on the cruise with your friend and enjoy being with your girl friends for a little and never look back.
If you love a person you make them a priority in your life. He is not making you a priorityin his life so therefore he shouldn’t be a priority in your life.
I really like you and this comment, GG!
LW, my best advice would be to be done with it once and for all, and then NO MORE CONTACT. Don’t even try to be friends, because he’ll suck you back in like a cheap whore or an expensive vacuum.
Go on your cruise. IT’S FREE! I’d commit a small crime for a free cruise!!! (maybe an act of vandalism, a misdemeanor, but nothing in the felony territory). Have a great time! Don’t even think about this guy. If you start thinking about him, do some activity the cruise offers. Last time (slash only time) I went on a cruise it was around the Greek Isles and I was dancing until 4 am with my biffle (BFFL) to Madonna and it was fabulous.
Let him take this girl to the wedding. Have a conversation with him where you tell him that this just isn’t working for you because (like Gator Girl said) you don’t feel like a priority to him…and that’s fine, it’s just the way it is (he’ll try to convince you you are, and maybe get defensive) but you don’t want to spend any more years feeling this way and the back and forth of this relationship. This guy sounds wishy-washy. He is not a good investment in your future. Do you really want to be with a guy who could (and has) take back his love on a whim? Imagine ending up with him, marrying him, having kids with him and then pulling this crap!! It sounds as if you stay with him any longer you’re just going to be wasting your time.
One day you will find a guy who will make you his priority and won’t break up with you umpteen times and you’ll wonder why the hell you went through this. I’m assuming you’re young (early twenties) and trust me, you have time to find that guy if that’s the case. Breaking up constantly is not the sign of a healthy relationship.
Now, if you REALLY want to be with him, (and I’d be a hypocrite if I didn’t say this, because my husband broke up with me for a month in the first year of our dating, telling me he wasn’t sure he was “in love” with me) I’d say if his behavior is consistent for at least 6-9 months where he is consistent with his love, I love you’s and the loving behavior, then yeah, maybe he’s changed and a new leaf has been turned over. My husband ended up after a few weeks going to all my friends and telling them he had made the worst mistake of his life and if he wasn’t “in love” with me then he didn’t truly know what love was before and asking them how to get me back. From then on, I never had any doubt as to his love for me because he showed it all the time. But I was on watch for a while. I never punished him for it, but was wary. If he had shown any signs of reverting back to the whiny “I don’t know if I’m in love with youuuu” crap, I’d have been out of there.
Aw thanks!
My fiance did the same thing in the begining of our relationship- back off for a while to figure out what his feelings were. But that’s what’s different- it was the begining of the relationship! Not dumping 3 times and random intervals and pulling the “love” card out to win them back. Mind game are NOT cool.
Exactly! It was once only, and to test feelings (but I didn’t want to be a hypocrite, so that’s why I gave her another “option” with my advice)
And we’re better off for it now, right? And you don’t doubt that he loves you now because he never did it again! Many happy years to you and your fiance! 🙂
I’m confused. This is a weird letter.
You’re ok with him going with another woman, but not ok with him going with another woman unless you approve?
So if it’s an “I don’t trust certain women, or you around certain women”, guess what, he can fuck anyone. Seriously, you could send him with your sister, and he could still nail her. Of course this means the woman has to be willing, but it’s not unheard of for whatever relationship a woman has to sleep with anothers boyfriend/husband/fbuddy/whatever.
Which is to say he wouldn’t meet someone else at the wedding anyway. It’s not like him and whoever are going to be a bubble together and not interact.
And since your cruise is 7-8 days? That’s plenty of time for him to screw around with some no-name lady. And he doesn’t even have to be at the wedding.
I’m not trying to be a jerk here, but there are a million scenarios that could happen that may or may not have anything to do with going to the wedding and his “date” all of which you wouldn’t approve of. Are you going to lock him up the rest of your trip, enlist a chaperone?
Come on, if you can’t trust the guy, move the hell on.
If the guy can’t be honest with his feelings instead of this flip-flopping thing, drop the guy.
Find some hot dude to have a 7 day fling with on your cruise and forget this uncommitted, stringing you along jerk.
This reminds me of 50 shades of grey- i just finished it last night. Terrible. Oh, this man is terrible for me and treats me badly but I’m just so addicted to him I can’t stop myself and I’ll fix him and his issues and we will be together. Seriously, that book is just as bad as twilight is concerning telling women every wrong, unhealthy thing to do in a relationship will turn out.
It will not turn out. Cut this idiot out of your life, and move on. Figure out how to have a healthy mature relationship, because this isn’t one, and when you finally experience it, you will understand how bad of a spot you are actually in right now.
Oh, and I had a relationship like this in high school, so I speak from experience.
What are you saying? Edward watching her outside her bedroom at night while she sleeps isn’t romantic? News to me.
It honestly scares me that the majority of young women saw and loved twilight, and the older women all read and loved 50. Wendy is going to have LWs until the end of time… Lol
Yes, it is pretty frightening. All my single friends love both Twilight and 50 Shades of Grey and go on and on about Edward and Christian. I don’t say anything because I don’t want to come off as a smug married person, but if those two douches are their romantic ideals, then I can understand why they are trapped in a cycle of unhealthy, twisted relationships.
I loved them both, and I’m 31.
However, I realize that both series are complete and utter pieces of crap. It’s just crap I found entertaining.
My crap is limited to: US Weekly, Perez Hilton, the new 90210, 19 Kids and Counting, the Kardashians, mini bottles of wine (that way you don’t have to worry about opening and not finishing an entire regular-sized bottle) and ketchup on mac & cheese. Other than those things, I conduct myself in the utmost classiest of ways. Except I like talking about poop and popping other people’s zits. But otherwise, 100% classy.
I love ketchup on mac & cheese. Sooooo good. And those mini bottles of wine.
DC has wine doggie bags… you can order a full bottle at a restaurant and then they recork it, put it in a “sealed bag” (staples work), and take the rest home with you. It’s one of the 2 or 3 things I can actually say I love that our very f-ed up City Council did awhile back. Revolutionary 🙂
I thought I was the only one who watched the new 90210. It’s so bad, but I can’t tear myself away!
I just fear that subconsciously when faced with a terrible relationship, like this LW, people revert to what they know. So of all they know is a terrible example of things, it’s not going to turn out well.
I think that if you are able to just appreciate it for its entertainment, that’s fine. I just don’t think that a lot of women, especially young girls, can do that
I totally think you’re right about people not being able to draw the line between good clean smutty fun, and what’s actually healthy and good.
Luckily, I can, so bring on Christian Grey and Edward! 🙂
All copies of 50 Shades and Twilight should come with a copy of “He’s Just Not That Into You” strapped to the back…with the part “THESE GIRLS ARE THE EXCEPTION, NOT THE RULE!!!” underlined, highlighted and bolded.
More young girls need to read Pride and Prejudice. Wanting a Mr. Darcy is a better aspiration.
I also love Peeta. He loved her from afar for 12 years and also helped save her life multiple times, and the only benefit he reaped (those who read Hunger Games will see what I did there) was that she remained alive, since they weren’t together.
I am a fan of the 50 shades series as well as the Twilight Saga/series but I can assure you that I wouldn’t date someone like Edward/Christian. Wayyyyyy too controlling for my tastes. I’d choose Jacob because he’s hotter and more relaxed and eats human food. I think most women probably understand on some level what love should be and what a relationship should be like . Enjoying fiction does not impede that instinct, at least not for me.
This letter only makes sense if you are 15 years old. Otherwise, move on.
The part about the BF telling her he’s in love with her, then he’s not, then he is again, really blows. That’s what would do it for me. If it wasn’t for that, I’d say she really doesn’t have the right to be mad that he wants to take someone else to the wedding when she was invited and then decided to do something else.
LW, you can’t see the forest for the trees. You are focusing on this small problem (that you won’t even remember 5 years down the line) rather than focusing on the huge problem which is your inability to leave a man who clearly doesn’t care about you.
LW – it just makes me so sad that you have wasted almost 4 years of your life on this jerk who doesn’t commit, isn’t honest about his feelings, and treats you like a dog that he left at home that he only plays with when he is bored.
MOA, and please if you are over 21 years old figure out why you are behaving like a lovesick teen wondering if her boyfriend is “in love” with her and willing to prove it. If you have to ask someone to prove how they feel – they haven’t been demonstrating it through their actions… and since actions speak louder than words TAKE HIM AT HIS WORD!! Stop pretending that feelings are there that aren’t, that your anything more than a convenience or crutch, and get a life. And get tested for STDs… I’ve got a sneaky feeling that neither of you has a clue what monogamy and commitment really means.
I wish I could thumb this up 100x. I was getting all tongue-tied trying to figure out a way to say exactly this. So, thank you!
LW – MOA and do not be his “friend” when you get back from your cruise. Detach from him completely. Been there, done that. It hurts like hell, but you will be just fine.
The wedding is the least of your problems. You’re wasting a lot time on a man who “takes back” that he loves you. I mean, really? The only people I interact with who take back things they said are the two boys I nanny and they’re 4 and 6 years old! Go on your cruise, kiss a random guy, and move on from this.
“This guy, “Jake,” and I have been together for 3 1/2 years now. During this time he has told me that he wasn’t in love with me but he does love me and really does care for me (he has broken up with me three times and then taken it back).”
LW, I’m not going to apologize for what I’m about to say. I refuse to read beyond these sentences. This is yet another letter to another advice columnist about how some guy is doing the “love you/not in love with you/love you not/I don’t want to lose you/let’s be friends/let’s have sex/go away/come back” mental gymnastics. I don’t want to read ANOTHER letter from some woman who is putting up with it over and over again and then wondering why the guy she pines for breaks her heart AGAIN. It’s like watching a car crash over and over again!!!
Seriously…when a guy breaks up with you and/or tells you he’s not in love with you….BELIEVE HIM! This is someone who is actually telling you what he thinks. It’s not open for interpretation. Period. It’s fruitless to sit around waiting for what you want to magically appear in front of your eyes.
Every single time I’ve ever uttered similar phrases, I guarantee you, there was no gray area or middle ground. What I said is exactly what I meant. Trying to dig around for deeper meaning is insulting to you both!
There are six billion people on this planet. Go find some other guy. I don’t know what the rest of your letter said, but hopefully this will suffice.
Yes!
That’s why I don’t think the dude is a total a hole. She is letting him do this to her. Why would he not be wishy washy and keep going back. She LETS him. And now, after all this time, she wants some grand gesture of his love. I mean come on. Really?
If I was a guy and found some poor sucker who let me treat them like hell and then yell “take backs” like we are playing at recess — and got away with it 3 times — I would be hanging around when it’s convenient to me too.
First time – shame on you
Second time – shame on me
Third time – well you have no respect for yourself at all, enjoy your misery
We’ve seen many letters written by women who were upset because their guy didn’t want go, or weren’t invited to their besties wedding. What’s he to make of this? She’s skipping town and he’s not invited and doesn’t want to go the wedding alone. These two CHILDREN are a walking disaster and that will most certainly happen leaving the entire world better off for it. She should go on the cruise and meet someone else as immature as herself. He should go to the wedding with his friend and get laid that night.
Love it! This gets a big old WFES!!
Hahaha! Seconded!
Thirded. Fast Eddie said exactly what I was thinking but couldn’t put into words.
He thinks you’re disposable. Are you going to keep acting like you are?
THIS X 1000000.
Ugh. I was in this exact same situation, for about 5 years. We were best friends, we were dating, we were just friends again, we were friends with sex, ad nauseum.
Sorry to say, but you have to drop him. Whatever is going on, it’s not working. You care about each other, but something isn’t meshing. I never did figure out what it was in my relationship either, but looking back, I do regret wasting all that time with him. I ended up alone on my 30th birthday wondering if I’d ever meet someone, and worrying that I’d never be able to have kids. You don’t want to be there. Give yourself a chance to meet someone new, someone who’s actually interested in having a real relationship with you. You’re not happy with the relationship you have right now, and you can’t change this guy. Clearly he’s unable to be what you want him to be for you. So you have to take care of you, and drop him.
Also, from someone else who’s been there, when I look back on my “relationship” with him, I just find the whole thing silly. I’m embarassed, really. It was stupid to hang on so long, and he wasn’t really worth it. Seriously, it’ll be hard, but you’ll get past it. There’s so much unhappiness with him that you won’t spend the rest of your life looking back fondly and wishing you were still with him. Trust me on that.
“when I look back on my “relationship” with him, I just find the whole thing silly. I’m embarassed, really. It was stupid to hang on so long, and he wasn’t really worth it.”
Exactly my thoughts about my past pathetic relationship. Exactly
Paraphrasing the musical South Pacific, you need to “wash that man right outta your hair,” LW.
Just face the facts: he’s not into you, nor does he consider your happiness, peace of mind, or your feelings in anything he does – so of course he will take another girl to a wedding or to bed, as the mood strikes him, because he d.o.e.s. n.o.t. c.a.r.e. a.b.o.u.t. y.o.u. His every action screams this information – what must happen before you hear the music?
Have a great time on the cruise – what lovely friends you have to give you such a treat!
Love the song reference 🙂
I am embarrassed to say that a few years ago, I was especially low-self-esteemy, and got myself into a relationshit with a guy who dumped me multiple times. Not taking him back for the last time was the wisest thing I did. Now I think back on that time and cringe at the way I allowed myself to be treated.
Move on. It might get better for a few days or weeks, but he will dump you again.
The problem isn’t that this guy wants to take another woman to a wedding- it’s that you have broken up several times and he has said he doesn’t love you. MOA
MOA.
Sometimes I feel like letters like this are fake. Nobody is this stupid on purpose right? And actually NEEDS advice from strangers or needs her stupidity called out for the world? But if she is real, MOA, get some self esteem, perspective, and stop playing games with immature d-bags.
For the 100th time: This dude does not love you. Forget his words and look at his actions. He has dumped you repeatedly. Walk away.
Here’s an idea: Go on the cruise, have a great time, and forget about this guy. When you get back from your trip, do not contact him, do not answer his phone calls/texts/emails, and just MOA.
The whole wedding thing doesn’t matter. Why? Because you shouldn’t be with this guy at all. He doesn’t love you and has made that very clear. If he were, he wouldn’t be wishy-washy about it or “take it back.”
Ask yourself why you would want to be with a man who has stated that he is not in love with you? I would suspect that he keeps coming back to you because his new relationships didn’t work out. You owe it to yourself to accept nothing less than a man who is genuinely into you. Please take some time away from any relationship and focus on answering that question and ask yourself why you think you don’t deserve better. Also, please do go on the cruise. Turn your phone to off so you are not checking for text messages every 5 minutes. Some time apart from this guy may be just what you need to get some clarity into your relationship so ENJOY yourself.
I agree with this 100%. Turn the phone off and don’t allow this d-bag into your head for one second. Of course he’ll try to call/text/contact you in some way just to keep his foot in the door and make sure you have him on your mind at all times. Don’t do it! Enjoy this cruise for everything it has to offer, and don’t give this dudeface “free rent in your head” – as my mother always says. This is a once in a lifetime opportunity (free cruises don’t fall into your lap every day), so don’t waste one minute of it thinking of this guy or this situation.
First, this guy doesn’t love you. Maybe he thinks he does, or maybe he likes boosting his ego by stringing you along. Either way, lose him. However, you made plans to go to a wedding and then made other plans to go on a cruise at the same time. That’s not very considerate, either. So, no, you have no right to get upset that he wants to take another girl to the wedding and you have no say as to who it is. You gave him a sign and he read it. Both of you are way too immature for any kind of meaningful relationship.
Dump him and never take him back again. You don’t deserve to be treated like that by some jerk. He’s obviously very fickle and doesn’t know what he wants. It also sounds like he’s taking advantage of you and expecting you to be there whenever it’s convenient for HIM only. I think you two should break up for good and figure out what you both actually want.
Go on the cruise and do not feel bad. Let him do whatever he wants with whatever girl he wants at the wedding. Also, enjoy your cruise, and feel free to flirt with whatever cutie with an accent you like.
If you are older than 20, you need to cut off all contact with this guy and MOA forever.
If you are still younger than 20, feel free to keep justifying this on/off again drama until you turn 20. Then dump him, (feel free to use the same line he used) and cut off all contact with this guy and MOA forever.
LW, I have to ask… just why? Sorry to sound crass, but is he really freaking good in bed or something? If that be the case, trust me, you can get it someplace else with someone else that will treat you a whole lot better. Good bed tango is about the only reason I can think of that you would want to hear “I love you, but I don’t love you and I am breaking up with you, but wait, I love you again” over and over again.
Please, get some self esteem and respect, enjoy your cruise, happy early birthday and MOA!
There’s two totally separate issues here. He’s wrong about the way he’s treated you and your relationship. (Then again — just because somebody wants to take you back — doesn’t mean you have to be taken, you know… Time to grow a back bone, girl!)
Oh, and yes. You are SO wrong about this wedding. You bailed. He gave his blessing — and honestly, he should. It’s just a freaking wedding. Why should he go alone? I don’t get all the drama and baggage some women attache to going to a wedding… He’s telling you to go have a great birthday. Deep down, I think even you know that your anger here is misplaced.
MOA.
It seems to me like you are both just using one another until someone better comes a long. Hey, no real crime in that I guess… But why not just actively go out and seek somebody better?
Then again — just because somebody wants to take you back — doesn’t mean you have to be taken, you know… Time to grow a back bone, girl!
THANK YOU.
For the love of gods. Put an end to this juvenile farce. MOA
It’s time to quit letting him jerk you around. Yes, you’re letting him. Now when I say it’s time to stop, I don’t mean make him jump through hoops to “prove” that he’s serious this time. I mean cut him off. Yes, it’s going to be difficult and it’s going to hurt, but it’s necessary. Sometimes two people just have trouble letting go, even when it’s obviously not working. I know I’ve been there, so don’t feel bad.
First, it was extremely rude to back out of an obligation, especially if it’s because something better came along. That’s just manners 101. You should not have backed out of the wedding. However, because your on/off boyfriend was ok with it then I guess it’s whatever. For the future, a move like that is major rudeness.
Second, since you’re the one who backed out, you cannot now dictate who goes to the wedding in your place. Should he take your feelings into account? Yes, he should always take your feelings into account. But, in this instance you’ve lost your veto power by pulling the dick move of bailing.
Third, don’t get back together with this guy. It’s obvious by the back and forth nature of the relationship that your ex doesn’t know what he wants. You need to find someone who knows that he wants to be with you and only you. In the meantime, enjoy being single. Have fun on your cruise.
I could not even finish reading this one, and that doesn’t happen often. Seriously, this was so full of immature, pointless problems, I just gave up. LW: break up with him, or if you already are in a state of broken-up, stay that way. Then stay single for a while so you can figure out what you want out of life, yourself, and a man. And maybe read a book or something.
See, there’s your problem right there.
You told him yes, then ditched him for a party time with your friends. If you were serious about this guy, you would have gone to the wedding (which you said you would go to).
You’re not serious about him, are you? I’m wondering if he has invited another woman along to kind of send a message to you about your lack of commitment.