“Should I Choose the Rich Guy or the Nice Guy?”
In a feature I call “Your Turn,” in which you, the readers, get to answer the question, I’m presenting the following letter without commentary from me:
Then, about six months ago, I met someone and totally fell hard. Rich Guy was travelling all the time, we weren’t exclusive, and it just happened. He was the nicest, most honest and loving guy I’d ever met and I felt like I’d won the lottery. Things were amazing for a few months. Unfortunately, every now and again, I’d get in touch with Rich Guy and my boyfriend would find out every time. He’d be obviously very upset and I’d promise to never do it again, only to give Rich Guy a call again a few weeks later.
“Should I Leave My Husband for a Man Who Has More Money?”
All of our calls are platonic, but we’ve gotten to know each other very well since I started dating Nice Guy, and I know now that Rich Guy has serious feelings for me. We know each other inside and out. We tell each other everything. I feel like I connect with him on a different level than I’ve ever connected before with someone, and I know he honestly feels the same way. He is one of those people that I will know for life.
Nice Guy is still nice, but things are slacking. Anything I ever tell him I don’t like, he says he will change and honestly tries to, but we just aren’t on the same level for a lot of things. He is a spender, I am a saver. He professionally isn’t where I am, and I think it bugs both of us, but in the past six months he hasn’t done much to advance.
“My Boyfriend Doesn’t Make Enough Money”
It would literally kill him if we broke up, but sometimes I feel like I’m staying with him just to make sure I don’t end up alone or with someone who cheats on me. His family is amazing, we get along really well, and I could totally see myself fitting in there, but something is just missing.
It breaks my heart to even picture leaving him, but I think of someone else *every day*. We live together and leaving will be hard (I know…only six months isn’t long enough for that, but what can I say?); But I feel like something is missing and I don’t want to regret not trying with someone that I have extreme chemistry with. What should I do? — Torn Between Rich Guy & Nice Guy
Honestly, it doesn’t sound like either one is the right one. Relationships are work, its true, but initially it shouldn’t be a struggle to decide if you want to be with someone or not. And it sounds like with both of these guys there are things holding you back.
Maybe what you need is a little distance, from both of them. With a little perspective, maybe it will be clear that your feelings for one of them is more enduring. Or maybe it will confirm that while they are both great guys that you shared some wonderful experiences with, neither one has the long-term potential.
The key to remember is the best deceivers seem the nicest. They’ve practiced their entire lives at it. So important to this decision is your exit options. What if your “nice” guy is a liar? Men can be the best of them. You better be ready for that going in. Just watch any of the shows on cable that show what men and humans are capable of doing. I’d make sure you would be happy divorcing whomever you marry should you want to do so.
You should dump both guys. You obviously don’t appreciate either man for who they actually are. Find someone who you agree with on financial AND emotional levels and can refrain from objectifying them based on their bank accounts and careers.
Honestly, apart from their codenames she doesn’t talk about their bank accounts at all (except to explain why she visits Rich Guy in places like Hollywood and Vegas and how he can afford to soak her in booze every weekend). She spends a lot more time (80% of the letter) on their personalities, relationship dynamics, and careers. Furthermore, her problems with both guys seem to stem from genuine and important differences. In short, I’m not sure why you seem so…bitter.
Respectful request for clarification?
The most glaring examples…
About RG: “he’s wealthy and so he’s always partying” – I know plenty of “rich guys” who aren’t “always partying” and many “poor guys” who ARE always partying, so why explain away his behavior because of his bank account?
About NG: “He professionally isn’t where I am, and I think it bugs both of us, but in the past six months he hasn’t done much to advance” – basically defining the success of the relationship by conforming to her values about what success looks like. Obviously, requiring him to have higher standards than he currently has in regard to his career (and, one can logically assume, making more money).
Admittedly, the “wealthy” don’t *have* to work like the rest of us, so they can afford to party all the time. Some choose not to, but work is still a hobby for them instead of a necessity. I thought that’s what she was getting at. But I’ve been harsh all day, so I’m trying to give people the benefit of the doubt on this one.
I wouldn’t go so far as to say that she’s entirely defining the success of the relationship by his career. If anything, I think it’s a perfectly realistic concern that their professional values don’t line up: some people reach a certain level where they are comfortable and don’t advance further, while others view that as slacking. Yes, he’s not conforming to her expectations, but isn’t that a problem anyway in that their expectations are not the same? Also, there’s such a thing as a lateral promotion (i.e. a change in title, authority, and/or better working location and perks, but no salary increase). My brother, who works in aluminum diecast manufacturing, was thrilled to get a lateral promotion from working the line to parts inspector because it means he doesn’t run the risk of machines blowing up in his face. No pay increase, but it was definitely an improvement on the career/responsibility front.
By the way, I do agree that she should not be with either of them. I just think it has more to do with her deep-seated fear of singledom than with how she sees these guys. In the end, I think the former is heavily influencing the latter, so I guess it’s all the same.
Just the fact that the LW defines these men as “Rich Guy” and “Nice Guy” is enough, isn’t it?
From the sound of things, you’ve already made up your mind, but you just want someone else to tell you to do it.
You need to break up with Nice guy. This really isn’t fair to him. You’re stringing him along and it’s not going to get better with him unless you cut ties with Rich Guy completely and you realize what you want.
That being said, cut ties with Rich Guy, at least for a while. You don’t know what you want right now and you need time to figure it out. Also, and probably more importantly, it sounds like you’re deathly afraid of being single, but that’s really what’s best for you right now.
Stop hurting two guys, as well as yourself, because you don’t know what you want.
I’m going to guess the reason things are lacking with Nice Guy is because you’re not fully committing to him because you’re still holding onto Rich Guy… not sure if that’s because he’s rich or because you really like him. Anyway, please break up with Nice Guy, and get over yourself… he’ll be just fine. I assure you, you breaking up with him isn’t going to “kill him.” In fact, it’ll probably be one of the best things that’s ever happened to him because it will allow him to find someone who will truly appreciate his “nice guy” status!
I find it incredibly narcissistic when people say that their breaking up with someone with “kill them” or whatever. You aren’t that great, sorry! He’s not going to throw himself on a knife because you aren’t blessing him with your presence! He’s going to be a bit bummed and then he’ll get over it.
It’s the “literally” part that gets me. No, he is not LITERALLY going to die just because he’s been dumped. There’s a difference between being bummed out and being 6 feet under.
totes.
That got to me too. The only way this will LITERALLY kill him is if she is a murderer. And then it won’t be the fact that she broke it off with him, but HER that killed him.
And if it does literally kill him, that’s his pathetic fault, not hers.
Oh, thank God someone said it!
Go for Rich Guy! It sounds like he’s who you wanted all along. But take things slow — like, don’t move in with Rich Guy as soon as you move out on Nice Guy. But it sounds like Rich Guy is worth taking a chance on if you have such a connection. And don’t let Nice Guy guilt you into staying — no, it won’t kill him if you break up, and if he threatens to harm himself if you leave, you don’t want to stay with someone like that anyway.
I agree with you. I (like many of you know about the abusive guy I was with for a long time) was withy someone who would say he would kill himself (literally) if I ever left him. Well I did leave him and guess what…HE NEVER KILLED HIMSELF!!! I hate when guys use that line. He may still not be over the relation ship (from like almost 9yrs ago…my sis is BFFs with his sis) but the point is, it is just a line to get you to stay with him
I wouldn’t talk so easily about this, people have threatened and actually followed through with suicide in situations like this. You never know.
My ex was a pathological liar and for about six months after I initially wanted to end things with him, he dragged me back into the relationship because when I wanted to leave him, he took a knife and cut the crap out of himself. It was horrible.. Those cuts left scars on both of us, physically for him and mentally for myself.
As for the LW, if you’re in a relationship with someone and actively think about pursuing a relationship with another guy then go and do just that. You obviously don’t care about the guy you’re with right now.
suicide is used as a manipulation tool a LOT. i dont think anyone would say that it isnt a very serious issue, and i dont think that emjay meant that in her post- but seriously, if you looked at statistics of people who threaten suicide and never follow through (because they were never actually suicidal), versus people in relationships who were suicidal and eventually did take their life, i would bet money more people use it as a manipulation tool. sad, but such is life.
Being suicidal and not following through is not necessarily because it was just being used as a tool. Sometimes people receive much needed help because someone took them seriously.
leave nice guy to find the nice girl he deserves and go get with the guy that you think of *everyday*, assuming he still so serious about you once he knows that you’re actually available again.
That’s a good point, it’s easy to want something you know you can’t have.
I’ve said it before on DW: when the question is, “Which boy should I choose?” the answer is no boys. You should choose no boys at all.
When it doesn’t occur to someone that being single is a very realistic option, then it’s obviously the option they should go with, because they’re very obviously avoiding something.
Agreed, but not just because there is a fear of being single. More that you if you are really in love (and haven’t been together for ages and ages), your heart doesn’t wander this way.
Yeah, I think it’s normal to have mini-crushes on another man/woman when you’re in a relationship, but when you are regularly torn as to who to live your life with, neither of these people are the right one for you.
Nice Guy isn’t for you. It is clear that you’re just not feeling it and that you’re only still with him because it is the easiest path. You both deserve better than this grasping-at-straws relationship.
However, I don’t know if you are in a great place to start something serious with Rich Guy, either. Sure, he seems exciting and intense. But I’d suggest ending your current relationship (it is not doing well even without Rich Guy in the picture). Then see if you can be single for a little while, or at least take a new relationship more slowly than you did this one. In your current relationship you have been dishonest, cowardly (staying because it’s easy) and moved along quite quickly. None of those traits bode well for any future relationship… and they kind of suggest that you’re not very comfortable with being alone. It all seems a little desperate and dramatic. Learn to be secure with singleness. Then when the right opportunity comes along, you’ll choose it because the other person is magical, not just available. You’ll have the wisdom and strength to make hard choices and move at a healthy pace.
6 months into a relationship is a pretty normal time to do an assessment to see if it’s going the way you want. If your boyfriend is not who you want to be with, for whatever your reasons are, that’s okay. It’s a shame that you already are living with him so soon, because that always makes breakups harder, but breaking up with your boyfriend will not “literally kill him”. If you truly cannot get this other guy out of your head than it’s not fair to drag your current relationship out any longer. However – can I suggest that you proceed with caution with the rich guy? Just take things slow and don’t get in over your head. It’s possible that he suddenly has feelings for you because he wants what he can’t have, and it’s also possible that you’ve built up the possibility of a relationship with him so much that you will be hurt even more if it doesn’t go as you hope.
Yes 6 months is a normal breakpoint because thats when you get past the initial new-relationship rush and begin to get comfortable.
It seems like she was hot for Nice Guy at first but then reality set in. LW, you fell hard but that initial fire fizzled as you got to know his quirks. How do you think things with Rich Guy will be any different?
For me the best part of a relationship is when you get to the comfortable stage; if you like the chase and the thrill and the fire (which is how your letter comes off) then every relationship is going to start slacking around the 6 month mark.
Its fine if you want to hop from dude to dude like this, but if you actually want a meaningful relationship then you should dump Nice Guy, skip Rich Guy, and get to know yourself a little better.
“It would literally kill him if we broke up…”
I say you put that to the test.
Is it bad that I read this sentence in Rob Lowe’s voice from Parks and Rec? Oddly, it was surprisingly positive/ upbeat…
LOL! Love this….love that show!
Yeah, poor use of the word literally here. At least I hope she doesn’t mean that he will literally commit suicide if she dumps him.
Ugh, it really annoys me when people don’t know the meaning of the word “literally.”
Yeah, break ups suck, but you know what sucks more? Staying with someone because he treats you well, you’re comfortable with him, and you don’t want to be alone. Meanwhile, you’re busy falling in love with someone else. He deserves better than that. Let him go so he can find someone that actually appreciates him, doesn’t act like she’s superior to him, and only stays with him because he won’t cheat on you – because that’s exactly what you’re doing to him, emotionally.
Haha. The “literally” bugged me too! Or maybe not, maybe he’ll die if she dumps him. Poor thing, he has no chance.
It made me think of the episode of HIMYM where everyone gets annoyed with each other and Robin’s annoying habit is that she says “literally” all the time.
Perhaps he has some sort of heart condition, and any sort of sudden upset could cause a fatal heart attack?
That part bugged me too… Actually, a lot about the whole tone of the letter bugged me, but I was *trying* to not be too harsh. But seriously? You’re such a catch he won’t be able to live without you? Maybe it was just a poor choice of words, but that (and a few other things) came across as highly conceited to me.
I tried not to be *too* harsh in my response, as well, but you’re certainly not the only one who got a very conceited, immature vibe from this whole letter.
I second that “literally” stuff!
Like, “If you don’t stop doing that, my head is literally going to explode.” Really? It is? Bits of your brains will be stuck to the wall? Cause unless you’re playing russian roulette that’s probably an exaggeration.
I just read the rest of your comment. I second that too.
Oh, looks like I actually fourthed it.
OT:
when I was little, my siblings and I used to play this game in the car if we smelled a skunk (our family used to drive to my grandparents’ houses a lot, at least a 8 hour drive, so this happened more than one would think).
Whoever noticed the skunk first would say, “I see/smell a dead skunk on the side of the road, I one it!” and we would each take turns counting off (I two it, I three it, etc) until someone eight the skunk, and the other two would screech “Ewww!! You ATE it?”.
When I got a little older, I thought it was funny to stop the game at the start and say, “You won it? You can keep it!”
For some reason your post reminded me, I haven’t thought about that in a long time!
You shouldn’t be with either of them. Rich Guy can’t give you what you know you need, and neither can nice guy. Yeah, if you combined them, maybe they’d be the guy for you, but you can’t do that. Staying with Nice Guy when you’re not fully invested in it isn’t a nice thing to do, and he doesn’t deserve to be with a girl who thinks about another guy “in that way” Every single day.
It’s only been 6 months- Break it off with him before you hurt him any more.
You’ve got to break up with Nice Guy. I assure you, it will not kill him. He has a great family, they will help tend to the broken heart that you are so sure a break up will cause.
As for Rich Guy, be aware that he may just want what he can’t have and might lose interest once you are more available. For what it’s worth, I hope you two get together and it works out well.
I predict Rich Guy will freak out and disappear the second he finds out that she dumped her boyfriend for him. He’s only confessing his feelings now because she’s with someone else.
I reached my BS tolerance limit at this part:
“We know each other inside and out. We tell each other everything. I feel like I connect with him on a different level than I’ve ever connected before with someone, and I know he honestly feels the same way.”
Well LW, if you have such an undeniable cosmic connection with RG then you need to stop toying with Literally Dying NG already. Sounds like you and RG deserve each other.
Yea…especially when she finds out he is only wanting something serious because *gasp* she stopped trying to be with him…
Staying in a relationship with someone because the breakup would kill them is not good.
Staying with someone and every day thinking of someone else is not good.
Staying with someone because you think they would not cheat on you is not good.
So, yeah, I would go for the rich guy, because at least the three problems above would be solved.
Oh, and yeah, treating someone as work-in-progress and waiting for them to change is not good.
Why do you call the one you have more passion for “Rich Guy”? When I read your description of him, it sounds like you’re into him because he gets you hot and because he’s rich. What happens when he no longer gets you hot? Passion cools. What happens if he loses his money? Fortunes come and go. Take those two variables out of the picture, do you truly still find yourself interested in developing a long term relationship with him?
Why do you call the one who treats you nice, but for whom you don’t have as much passion “Nice Guy”? When I read your description of him, it sounds like he’s a place holder for you – someone you know you’re supposed to like, someone who is reliable, someone who, on paper, is perfect, but there’s no spark for you. Never will be a spark for you. But you see him because, well something’s better than nothing. If the tables were turned, would you want him to treat you like that?
Only you can answer these questions. Are you ready to honestly answer them?
Now to the advice: Let them both go and grow some more personally. Date casually, and really learn what you want in a guy – not just superfically. What you want from a life partner, not a placeholder.
Once you figure that out, then start dating seriously.
But don’t date either of these guys. It’s clear you’re not into Nice Guy and Rich Guy is playing with you the same way you’re playing with Nice Guy, but you don’t really mind because Rich Guy is, well, rich. Do you really want to be that girl?
What Tracey said!
Money comes and goes. But the person you love and are with is there forever.
“Money comes and goes. But the person you love and are with is there forever.”
Just want to point out that often, people come and go as well, whether or not you love them.
Dear future and current LW’s:
If you write in, saying you can’t choose between two guys, advice from the majority of commenters will ALWAYS be to “choose neither,” figure out who you are as a single person, and “grow up”/”stop being immature.”
If you label someone as “rich guy,” the advice will NEVER be to be with him.
If you label someone as “nice guy,” the advice will overwhelmingly be that you don’t deserve him, so give him the chance to find love with someone “who can appreciate him.”
Those are just the rules. It’s how it works. If you want advice that addresses the core of what you’re feeling, don’t use these descriptors. They’re a distraction.
Also, learn the meaning of the word “literally.”
Sincerely,
6
Ahhh this is amazing. <3
STOP TELLING THE SECRETS YOU’LL CUT DOWN ON THE TRAFFIC HERE!
I nominate 6nap for guest columnist! Next to RR, this advice is perfection.
nomination seconded.
Thirded.
I’d also like to point out that when the tone of your letter is hand-to-the-forehead-DRAMATIC – “He would literally DIE,” “I think of someone else *every day*,” I felt like I’d won the lottery,” – you will find it difficult to be taken seriously.
So true! I almost didn’t even read this (the letter OR the comments) because I knew what it would all say.
if rich guy liked you so much he would have asked you out ages ago when you were actually dating. I don’t believe it for a second when you say that you guys were in the same place about not wanting a relationship earlier and now *gasp* you both want a relationship at the EXACT same time. Yeah….it’s because you’re with someone else and it’s an ego boost to lure someone away from that. That being said, you clearly don’t like ng.
Wow. How the hell can you commit to one relationship when you are pining for another?
You say that you never had any expectations with RG. You’re carrying quite the torch for this guy that says otherwise. Either he does like you, or he’s stringing you along something fierce. Find out. Otherwise, you may be leaving NG for nothing. Granted, if you can’t commit to NG, you should be leaving him so he can find a “Nice Girl” that will commit to him.
Your problem is that you are scared of being alone and you’d rather play two guys and look like a slut than be seen as someone who can’t get a guy at all. You should be more worried about your character and your self-worth. Get your shit together. I’m all for taking risks, but not when they risk other people’s emotions and well being.
You sure seem to think a lot of yourself. “It would literally kill him if we broke up”. Really? NG would DIE if you broke up with him? Would his heart just give out, or would he kill himself, or would the gods strike him dead? I doubt it. I think you meant “figuratively” at best. Or “emotionally” is the word you were most likely looking for. Either way – I think that most likely, you and NG won’t last, RG is probably liking you because you are as shallow as he is and therefore a better match – but don’t expect it to last more than 18 months.
There are a few things that bother me about this letter. It all seems very flippant and immature – “I liked this guy, but then I moved in with this guy, but now I like the other guy again.” Sheesh!
Another thing that bothered me was this: “Anything I ever tell him I don’t like, he says he will change.” Is that how you conduct relationships, LW? Telling someone “I don’t like this – change it!” is not a very mature, intelligent way to conduct a relationship. I understand that sometimes, you feel that your partner could be achieving more or aspiring to more, but your approach is way off.
And this, too: “Unfortunately, every now and again, I’d get in touch with Rich Guy and my boyfriend would find out every time.” You say “unfortunately” like you had no control over it. Come on.
Sometimes, people say things in passing that end up being a HUGE point that they simply don’t want to admit to themselves. You did that when you said: “Sometimes I feel like I’m staying with him just to make sure I don’t end up alone or with someone who cheats on me.” I don’t think you meant “sometimes.” I think you meant – “I feel this way deep down, but I’m too scared to acknowledge it because then I’d have to deal with that particular feeling.”
My advice? Break up with your boyfriend. He’s obviously not right for you, because you seem less than satisfied in your relationship and clearly want to change him (FYI – trying to change someone is a big red flag that you’re in the wrong relationship). I honestly don’t think you’ll avoid dating this “Rich Guy,” though I wish you would. More than anything, it sounds like you need a good dose of “SINGLE” and some time to mature, deal with your relationship insecurities (AKA…staying with someone so you won’t be alone), and figure out what you really NEED in a relationship.
However…I don’t think you’ll do that. I think your intense draw to this “Rich Guy” won’t be denied. Which, honestly, is fine. Date him. Get it out of your system. Maybe there’s a chance it will go somewhere. But, very bluntly, be prepared for heartbreak. It seems like you two thrive off of the “forbidden” aspect of it, and neither of you sound ready for a truly “serious” relationship. Either way, your current boyfriend deserves to be single, so do that much for him.
hopefully the LW reads your response because I think you’re completely right.
I think RR is right too.
I would like to add that it’s a little fishy that Rich Guy expressed feelings to you only after you were dating someone else. If he was really that into you, he would have said something sooner. Dating him will end in heartbreak for at least one party. With that being said, I still think you should end it with Nice Guy. Do the right thing and let him find someone who appreciates him fully. LW, you do not. Not that there is anything wrong with that . . . . just recognize it and move on. You’ll eventually find the right person for you.
This reminds me from a line in the movie House bunny “Boys want what other boys want” love Anna Faris!
me too.
Between this post and the response to the other letter, RR is batting 1.000 today.
Love your reasoning!!!! You should be a therapist or psycologist. (Probably spelled wrong, not my strong suit! LOL)
I fully intend on it emjay…I just have to go to grad school, do an internship, practice under a licensed therapist for a few THOUSAND hours, take my board exams, etc. So in about 10 years (yikes!), I should be a therapist if all goes well.
My program took 5, plus a year-long postdoc to get licensed. You got this, RR.
I’m in year 6 of that process… woot woot!
Good god, Regina, I wish you could be my therapist. It’s not fair that you (a) don’t live in Chicago and (b) are not already a licensed therapist but regardless (c) can I talk to you about the douchebag neighbor I’m sleeping with? I think you can help me. And when I’m the thriving, empowered woman I wish I were, I’ll write you a glowing recommendation for therapy school…. deal?
Discipline. Only need it as long as it takes to find a non-douchebag.
My issues run deeper, like I think I only like douchebags. And am letting what was supposed to be a casual “neighbors with benefits” situation is making me an emotional wreck. This is where Wendy, RR, and you will say: THEN STOP SLEEPING WITH THE FUCKING NEIGHBOR. Which, for some reason, I am having a really hard time doing. But what makes me the most sad/upset with myself is the fact that I am drawn to this bad relationship. Eh, I’m not goot at articulating my feelings because I’m having a hard time understanding my feelings…. I am going to get back to this motion I am drafting. I am better at articulating why my judge should grant my motion. Well even that is debatable. FML.
EMAIL ME. DO IT. CONSIDER THIS PEER PRESSURE. But seriously…I’m itching to help you get to the bottom of this. My door (gmail account) is always open.
Email sent. 😉
Ok, 4 emails sent.
Why don’t you live in NY and sit on my porch with a glass, scratch that, bottle! of wine. Why, oh why is the world not fair?
Actually, I can see why that would be hard given the proximity factor. Normally we would probably tell you to cut all ties with the dude and go on a soul-searching mission of awesomeness, but the first part would be hard to do with a neighbor. One doesn’t move on a whim (or at least tries to avoid doing so) especially if you own a house.
Good luck Addie! (and sorry for butting in)
Budj, can you enlighten us – Where do the non-douchebags hang out. I have a very strong belief that I won’t find my “person” in a bar. But where exactly DO dudes in their mid-late 20’s who are NOT douches hang out?? I imagine them playing video games on a Saturday afternoon, or playing football outside. I’m also not interested in online dating yet…I feel that at 23, I should save that until I’m 30 and my baby-making machine is ticking.
Yup, thats where! My boyfriend, a non douchebag, was definitely playing video games on Saturday afternoons before I found him.
He still does, but has to cut it short to take me to dinner every now and then.
Are you implying on-line dating is for the 30+ and desperate club?
*tsk tsk tsk!
Haha, no! I think online dating is a GREAT thing and it works well for a lot of people. But, right now, I just don’t think it’s for me. If I’m still single in a few years, I’ll definitely be re-evaluating my approach on dating!
pedal, back. 🙂
*Hangs head in shame*
Hold that head up high, girl!
It worked for me and I was 23 when I met my bf 🙂 and it worked for my sister in law who was only 24 when she met my brother!
I met mine in a gas station. 🙂 Sometimes it really is the least likely place!
While you can find douchebags in every crowd, might I suggest finding a local church. If they don’t have a congregation dedicated entirely to singles, they may at least have programs set up in that direction. You’re much more likely to find a non-douchebag on a pew than on a bar stool.
That’s where I met my wife when I was about your age and we’re still going strong at 14+ years.
That’s my $0.02.
I’m quite serious when I say that if you really want me to help you out, email me! The account I use for my freelance writing is: [email protected]. In all seriousness, I would love to help you out, and be your unlicensed therapist!
I second the “Come on!” and “Sheesh”
Here is my prediction: LW will break up with the current bf and go for the Rich Guy. Once RG realizes that the chase is over, he’ll dump her.
What I hope happens is that they both dump her and she spends time alone and goes to therapy and tries to figure out why she is never satisfied with what she has.
I married a ‘nice guy’, please if you’re not ready for a nice guy don’t get involved. Nothing worst then seeing a nice individual be strung along like this. You’re not Hanna Montana, and look at the real Miley Cyrus. Sorry, you can’t have the best of both worlds.
I’m craving me some “Party in the USA” now. Thanks, geez.
I’m just going to throw out there that sometimes people do need some advice without being criticized or judged on the way they wrote things in there letter. It’s no different than text messages…many a times the text is taken out of proportion and read the wrong way. Perhaps LW is seriously confused in this matter, is not a gold digger, truly is torn between the two guys, and is looking for some positive advice that won’t put her down. The only reason why I’m saying this is because I had been in this situation at one point in my life as well….and I got called different “names” because I liked two men (and that doesn’t mean I was having sexual encounters with them).
Either way LW, you will figure out what is right for you. In my situation, I ended up with neither of the men and am now married to the man of my dreams. I couldn’t be happier and some day, you will find that too. Follow your heart.
I happen to agree with you, and was only partly being snarky with my response. The problem is that the way she wrote it, it’s really hard to tell what her genuine issue is. Is it that she loves the LA guy, but is worrying about losing the stability of her man? Is it that she loves her guy but can’t help but worry about his financial future and is feeling like her life lacks adventure? Is it that she really doesn’t love either but is tempted by both?
I agree with you that feelings can be torn in different directions and I didn’t get the feeling she was a golddigger or a slut. I was dead serious that the phrasing of the question IS a distractor and that LW’s should avoid those pitfalls in the hopes of getting better advice.
C’mon… what you’re doing is pacifying. Cute, but not cool.
Sometimes, you gotta call a spade a spade and not a “thing you can shovel snow with”. Lay it out. We’re adults and can handle the truth. If the shoe doesn’t fit, then don’t wear it.
You really are a city boy. A spade is something you shovel soil with. A snow shovel is something you shovel snow with.
Touche.
Oh hell. That was funny.
Part of the problem is the way she identifies each guy. She specifies one as rich and one as nice. She makes it seem like those are each of the redeeming factor about each guy. It makes it hard to be sympathetic with her when one of the guys she wants to be with is (it sounds like) for a large part because of his bank account.
Here’s my interpretation.
You really wanted to be in an exclusive committed relationship with Rich Guy but he didn’t want that so you settled for an FWB relationship because you liked the excitement and because his money probably opened (club) doors and whatnot.
But then, you met Poor Guy who did all the things Rich Guy didn’t in terms of wooing you. Made you the center of his universe and you liked that –so a whirlwind romance and quick move-in ensued.
Problem is that Poor Guy is easy and not-so-exciting.
Meantime, Rich Guy just sat up and realized that he didn’t have exclusive rights to his FWB anymore and hey, that’s not cool. So SUDDENLY he has real feelings and you are his soulmate. Even though he had months to figure that out before Poor Guy came along.
And really you and Rich Guy are no different. You both find a relationship conquest MUCH more satisfying when its resisted you first. But that’s SUCH a false promise, trust me.
Rich Guy is man-boy who is going to continue to party, to attract women easily because his carefree, commitment-resistant, happy spending ways are as old as dirt –and we girls fall for it time and again.
Poor Guy is trying to fill a void because he’s not succeeding on his own and living up to his own expectations. And like you and Rich Guy, he’s chasing after something that’s resisting him.
And so, all of you should MOA from one another and take some time to find happiness and satisfaction from things OTHER than people. What is rewarding in your life? What would fulfill you other than a relationship? Furthermore, what strengths and weaknesses do YOU bring to the table? And how can you work on those so as to be the best possible (read: independently) happy partner in your next relationship?
That’s where its at.
Remember LW was trying to not come off as materialistic and labeled BF as “nice guy”. 🙂
Apart from that, spot on!
Yeah I realized that after I submitted but you know what? I find it even more interesting the way she has phrased it. To me, calling one guy Rich –implies by definition that the other one isn’t. And calling one guy Nice –implies the other one isn’t.
So that leaves us with:
— a Rich, Not-Nice guy
— a Poor, Too-Nice guy.
So, you don’t want to end up alone, or with someone who will cheat on you. So you string along *two* men, emotionally cheating on the Nice Guy with the Rich Guy, calling your reaching out “unfortunate” instead of “deliberate” or “a ridiculous display of scumbaggery.”
Brilliant.
Girl, you don’t deserve either of them. You definitely don’t deserve Nice Guy, and as far as Rich Guy is concerned, has his lifestyle changed? Are you suddenly okay with his partying around? Are you cool with the fact that he is the kind of guy who will entertain women (emotionally at least, who knows how else) who are in committed relationships and LIVING WITH other men? If he can (emotionally) cheat WITH you, who’s to say he won’t emotionally cheat ON you.
Liked for the phrase “a ridiculous display of scumbaggery” hahaha.
I wish I could upboat you more than once.
I was hoping someone would point this out, I think I almost hit my snark limit for the day. 🙂
Her comment about “he’s always partying and I didn’t want to deal with all of the stress that I thought would come with trying to be exclusive with him,” which I took as she doesnt trust him not to cheat. Or find out about unfortunate secret “platonic” phone calls with women he may or may not be falling for…
Your 2nd paragraph is a point I really wanted to make, but my response was getting long haha. I’m glad you pointed it out!! – Yeah, it’s naive to think that Rich Guy all of a sudden matured and decided he was ready for a serious relationship, and the fact that he’s participating in the LW’s emotional “affair” says a lot about his morals and priorities. If he’s doing it with you…he’ll do it with someone else, too.
My god this is like every episode of Sex and the City and the reason why I hated that show. You have your Mr. Big and you have your Aiden. At the end of the movie when she chose Mr. Big, all the girls in the audience were like “awwwww”- I stood up and yelled WTF?!?!?!?!? In this situation ‘Aiden’ doesn’t deserve you- how self centered can you get? I am sorry, but you sound like you are just glutton for punishment and don’t appreciate something good when it comes along so it sounds like you and your “Mr. Big” are made for each other. I can’t wait to read the follow up where you need advice on how to deal with him breaking your heart after the ‘sacrifice’ you made breaking up with your nice guy for him. I am all for following your heart, so please- if Nice Guy isn’t doing it for you, you need to cut him loose- do it now. How uncaring and messed up of you to drag him along because of ‘not wanting to be alone or wanting to be cheated on’ while he does all he can to make you happy. You continuously do something you know hurts him (calling Mr. Big) and have no regard for his feelings when you do so. You think only about what you want, at the cost of someone’s self esteem and trust- the number one reason why you are not ready for ANY relationship right now. I could go on forever, but I really feel that it is one of the lowest things you can do to a person. I don’t really foresee a very healthy relationship for you in the near future, you have far too much growing up to do.
Yay for Sex and the City reference! I always thought that it was total crap that Carrie picked Big over Aiden. I think that any real woman would have picked Aiden. And how Big all of a sdden turned into this nice, committed, guy during the movies when in real life he would’ve been a bachelor suger daddy for the rest of his days.
wow sorry my spelling was so horrible on that one! Don’t know what’s wrong with me, or my keyboard!
I literally wanna ask how old you are, because you literally like oh em gee… literally like sound like a spoiled brat.
*cough cough… did i say that?
Yes, I did. Get over yourself.
$5 says “Rich Guy” is some married dude (possibly older) who can and will whisk you away for alcohol-filled orgies via LAS/LAX. My guess is, if there was anything worthy of this chap, you’d have thrown it out. But you didn’t so I won’t read too much into that.
While you’re binging and fornicating with said Rich Guy, this Nice Guy is probably wondering to himself – WTF am I doing here?! Why should I keep shedding QT over this party-girl?
So to answer your question of what you should do, I say: Get.Over.Yourself and Get.Serious.
Like… literally.
OH MY GAWDUH! LIKE NO WAI!
I know… like *smacks gum*… way!
Maybe the LW is Courtney Stodden… with her rill hair and rill (FAKE) boobies.
Is it sad that your comment warranted a search for “courtney stodden?”
*don’t answer that.
That you didn’t know who she is makes me happy for you.
And sad for me, because I did know.
No…it’s a wonderful thing! I wish I was unaware of her as well.
I cannot WAIT for their reality tv show to come out so I can secrety watch it all the time while pretending to be above it all.
This thread is literally making my day better. Like, for rill.
LW, scrap the living together argument as a factor in this break up. I’m guessing you two haven’t lived together for more than 4 or 5 months…it would be sucky, yes, but not impossible to move out. You couldn’t have made too many large purchases together(considering Nice Guy’s financial state), so pack your junk and leave.
Do all the single ladies out there a favor and breakup with Nice Guy. Go have fun with Rich Guy for a while, and when you’re ready for a serious relationship, find a different nice guy. Let someone who is ready for a serious relationship now have your Nice Guy.
dump them both, and only strart dating when you have grown up and can handle a real raltionship, warts and all
OMG – “warts and all”, and all I could think of was this.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OaWB-0VkTXs
I am such a geek.
What….how…what…why….what???
I watched it and I don’t understand, lol. Yet I’m laughing!
I love Chrono Trigger.
What is it about you that Rich Guy totally gets? That you’re an alcoholic?
Are you kidding, LW? Leave Nice Guy alone – he doesn’t deserve to be screwed over by you. Rich Guy is your match, he enjoyed you with no strings attached when you were single and only got serious when you settled in with someone else, while you enjoyed him with no strings attached when you were single and are now hankering for him and having one foot out the door the whole time you’re with your boyfriend. You and Rich Guy are equally shallow and shady, so go for it.
If you bought a pair of shoes that didn’t quite fit you’d leave them in the closet for when nothing else goes with the outfit on rare occasions. Comfortable sensible shoes are to come home to and wear most of the time. They go with anything but not much for the look of them but they just feel so dam good.
Same goes for life long partner. Time to go shopping.
Is this real? First and foremost, unless you have a murderous streak, a breakup will not “literally” kill your guy. Literal means for real. Like actually dead.
Sorry. Anyway, if when describing rich guy to us, the main thing we learn is that he’s rich and that you guys had a casual relationship because he was being a party boy, it doesn’t sound like there’s anything there to pursue. It sounds like he was missing all your attention and wanted to get back up on the pedestal.
It sounds like you and nice guy don’t click, and that’s fine. I’m sure you’re a great girl, but he’ll get over a breakup with you. Everyone goes through breakups. It happens. Something that bugs me about letters is that people always think it has to be between one guy or another. If neither guy really works for you, then don’t date either of them. It’s a much better option than trying to choose the lesser of two evils, so to speak.
You’re having “the grass looks greener on the other side of the fence” dilemma. My response to that is the grass is greenest where you water it. You’re spending so much time pining after rich dude and relishing your forbidden sneaky phone calls that of course mr nice guy boyfriend seems lame bc you’re not putting forth any effort into it. You’re make a chump out of Mr. Nice guy, do the right thing and let him go, instead of making him feel like crap telling him all the things he does wrong and that he needs to change to make you happy. That’s mean and you know it. Quit making excuses to break up with him that make it like it’s his fault…dump him bc you’re more interested in rich guy than him. It is what it is. Something tells me though that the grass is greener because there’s more shit over there. Lol.
Dump nice guy and be with rich guy otherwise you will always regret it. Once rich guy gets bored with you and moves onto something younger/hotter/’gets him more’ then you can make up with nice guy or some similar sucker.
Hopefully it won’t take rich guy too long to get bored with you, otherwise you might find you are well past your ‘use by date’ and all the nice guys are not interested you.
LW, you sound like one of my good friends who goes from guy to guy to guy…and she just never seems to be happy in her relationships.
Many valid points have already been put on the table here. Dump both guys. Neither is a good fit for you.
In your relationship diet, Rich Guy is your turtle cheesecake. Not good for you health wise, but DELICIOUS all the same. You like the thrill he gives you…and that’s about all he has to offer. You end up regretting it in the morning. Sorry dearie, but that’s not the base for a good, solid relationship. On the other hand, you see Nice Guy as your box of generic bran flakes: pretty plain and bland but you eat them in the morning because you feel like you have to in order to keep healthy. Now, you can’t survive on just turtle cheesecake or just bran flakes. You need a nice well-balanced diet.
You are stringing Nice Guy along. He doesn’t deserve that. The fact that you are STILL seeing Rich Guy on the side while LIVING with Nice Guy is NOT A GOOD SIGN. Take some time for yourself, be single for a while, and figure out what it is you want. If things are meant to be with either of these guys, they will somehow come back into your life. For now, find YOURSELF first. Maybe do some casual dating once you’ve spent some time discovering yourself. It’s ok to be single. It’s ok to be alone and rely on yourself. It doesn’t doom you to become a crazy single spinster. It helps build your confidence in yourself and your abilities to be independent. That, dear LW, is what you need right now. Confidence and independence.
And for the record, from my experience the Nice Guys of the world are almost ALWAYS the better choice.
Good luck!
You should leave *both*. You are not into Nice Guy enough to have an honest future with him, and all you’re doing is leading him on. You don’t trust Rich Guy to stay true to you, so why set yourself up for heartache you’re sure will happen? You don’t have just these two options. You sound to me like you are the kind of girl who can’t be single. So you know what you should do? Be single! Don’t man-hop. Give yourself an opportunity to really be in tune with *you* and *you’re* needs and wants. The only way to be honest with yourself about the kind of man that fits your needs is to take a step back from the man-colored glasses that are clouding your vision of you.
LW – you sound like you must be pretty young. You aren’t going to end up with either of these guys. It sounds like you want to leave NG, and you don’t need a good reason to do so. Wanting to leave is enough. That’s all the reason you need. No one will die, literally or figuratively. Hearts may get broken, but that’s what they’re for. If you want to date RG, date him. It won’t last, but that’s OK. You’ll still have fun and hopefully learn something about yourself. Ten years from now you will look back and laugh at yourself a little for agonizing over this so much.
Just to want to give the LW something else to consider: If you dump the Nice guy for Rich guy, you might find that Rich guy actually sucks in a relationship. Not even too-much-partying-and-philandering kind of “sucks”, but just…not what you want. The reason things are so great with you guys in because you AREN’T in a relationship with him. Relationships are hard, and once you’re close to a person, you’ll start to see that they have flaws. Do you know how Rich guy would be in a relationship? There are going to be things you don’t like about him, just like how you don’t like certain things about Nice guy.
There’s also a possibility he’s one of those people who’s personality completely changes while in a relationship. I have a friend who is VERY fun to be around, always partying, and we had a casual relationship at one time because he was great to bring out. But I’ve also witnessed some of his serious relationship, and he becomes kind of a boring homebody when he’s in one. So LW, all the things you like about Rich guy could completely change if you were ever to get serious with him.
I would say dump nice guy, and go for the rich guy. Marry him, and then divorce him once he cheats on you, because all of those trips he is on (do you really think he won’t be boozing with a bunch of girls just because you aren’t there?). You can then become rich single girl, and maybe get a nice reality TV show out of the deal. Either way we all know you are going to go with rich guy, because all of the sudden he connects with you on some other worldly level. If nice guy wrote into Wendy I would tell him to dump you, because you are already treating rich guy like your BF because of all of the things you share with him instead of nice guy.
Certainly you are emotionally cheating on NiceGuy right now this very minute. You live with him while you are pining for RichGuy? Put on the big girl pants and MOA probably from both. If the roles were reversed and some guy was cheating on you with another girl and you kept finding out about it, wouldn’t that guy be a ‘douch’ as people are always saying?
In this case, that person is YOU. You are being a coward living with one and wishing for the other. Move out, stop seeing both, and get your head around what you want, and what effect your actions have on others.
karma being who she is, you may pay large for this later.
Rich Guy = Alpha
Nice Guy = Beta
Nice guy is everything she says she wants, but it is not what she emotionally wants. She really desires Alpha Rich guy…but she also knows that he will not be there for her long term. She is having a debate between her brain and her loin. If she were a man it would be thinking withe big head vs the little head.
Maybe the male of the species is far more romantic than females are. When I met the right woman I could think of none other. She sounds like she is picking out the right blouse at a department store. I agree with the consensus that she should dump them both. She is just not really into either of them. I would not base what should be a lifetime commitment on money (the rich guy) or on professional status (sounds like you already consider Mr. Nice Guy as beneath you.)
Torn Between seems to be having difficulty between the known Nice Guy, and the unknown Rich Guy. She has obviously been spending enough time over 6 months to know that there are certain things about him that she does not like, and some things that she does like, especially a great family relationship. She may not like his career path, but at least the Nice Guy seems to be spending most of his time in a productive way at work. What does she know about Rich Guy over the last 6 months other than what he tells her on the phone? That he is getting his drink on at the Bellagio? I’m sure that is not all he is getting on if that is the way he is living. Herpes…at least. If she goes after Rich Guy and snags him, what is she going to do when she decides that she doesn’t want to wake up with a hangover the rest of her life? Change Rich Guy too? Good luck with that. Nice Guy at least seems to have this old fashioned quality known as “Character”, and I don’t see any of that in Rich Guy. I’d say that Torn Between is one of many women that Rich Guy is stringing along. What the hell else does he have to do?
TO: Torn, Wendy, et al.
RE: Not….
….enough information.
Years ago, I was the ‘nice guy’. She went with the handsome guy who wasn’t a ‘geek’ like me.
He ran around on her. They divorced. She married someone who ‘resembled’ me, but he wasn’t me. He ran around on her too. They divorced.
Why either of them would run around on this dazzling blonde with brains between her ears on a par with Mensa, is beyond my ken.
Enough of me, for background. Back on topic.
Torn, you’ve got ‘issues’. Whether or not you can resolve them, i.e., rise above your gonads, is up to you. With the little information you’ve given us about this situation, we can hardly give you good advice on which way to go.
Pardon my blatant Christianity, but I’d recommend prayer. That is IF you’re a christian yourself. If not….well….as the saying goes….YOU’RE ON YOUR OWN!
Hope that helps….
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Who can find a virtuous woman? Her worth is greater than rubies. — Proverbs 31]
I do not think the situation in the letter is real. It sounds like a summary of Sex in the City.
Rich guy is Mr Big and nice guy is Aiden.
Stay with the nice guy and be happy. Do the rich guy on the side.
After reading that, I felt quite sorry for both Rich Guy and Nice Guy. I hope they’re able to escape, and go on to lead happy lives with a valuable lesson learned.
I’m glad Instapundit links to this site every now and again. Every time I think I want to start dating again I get a nice reality check.
Dump Mr. Nice guy. Please. Guys who deeply love and respect a girl need help, they don’t need a girl like you. Direct him to some blog site which discusses modern women realistically. He’ll be shocked but thank you in the end. Maybe you could really help him out by explaining to him (and showing to him) just what it takes to make women happy. He likely has no clue.
Then, go party on with Mr. Rich for as long as you can. Life is short.
You don’t sound like a good marriage partner, so don’t even go there. Marriage is all about giving, not taking.
But, just DO NOT MARRY THE NICE GUY. He deserves a lot better and you would just be miserable, as would he.
“When it doesn’t occur to someone that being single is a very realistic option, then it’s obviously the option they should go with, because they’re very obviously avoiding something. ”
Or, when someone makes a comment like this, they’re obviously trying to convince themselves that an obviously bad situation is good.
You know, I had a similar dilemma choosing between between “hot chick” and “nice chick,” and… uh, well, actually, that choice wasn’t really so difficult after all.
Whatever she does, she should keep her thought process to herself. Neither guy is going to want to be with her if he finds out what she’s really about. The LW’s case is a good example of why I’m wary of women who’ve had flings with wealthier guys – and especially of the ‘every other weekend – fly me to Vegas for partying and sex variety’. In my experience, you’re always competing against the lifestyle and status that they can provide. Even if the wealthier guy is a completely ass, he’s always in the background as a ‘might have been’. She’s eventually going to be disappointed by the fact that you can’t provide those things. Also it’s a sign that she’s probably a big gold-diggerish.
Whatever she does, she should keep her thought process to herself. Neither guy is going to want to be with her if he finds out what she’s really about. The LW’s case is a good example of why I’m wary of women who’ve had flings with wealthier guys – and especially of the ‘every other weekend – fly me to Vegas for partying and sex variety’. In my experience, you’re always competing against the lifestyle and status that they can provide. Even if the wealthier guy is a completely ass, he’s always in the background as a ‘might have been’. She’s eventually going to be disappointed by the fact that you can’t provide those things. Also it’s a sign that she’s probably a bit gold-diggerish.
Torn,
That you’re a saver is good. It’s also clear that you’re a “material girl” and judge people based on professional success and bank account. There’s nothing wrong with that. There IS something wrong with stringing Mr. Nice along simply b/c you know he thinks of you as a catch, whereas Mr. Rich pretty much knows you’re just a lay he can buy with a plane ticket unless YOU step up and prove otherwise.
Strongly suggest doing so as quickly as possible. OR, grow up and realize that there are no “perfect catches.” (corollary: neither are you) Mr. Nice is willing to change for you, and that’s pushing you away from him? That should tell you everything you need to know.
Sink those hooks into Mr. Rich and figure out what you have to do to hold onto him. And no, he’s not going to be faithful: but guess what? Neither are you, so what’s the problem?
It’s just as easy to fall in love with a rich guy as with a poor one. If I had a daughter I would encourage her to fall in love with a rich guy. I just would. Sure it has its challenges, but nothing so daunting as poverty.
If she didn’t love a rich guy, then I’d have to accept her choice to live in want and penury, working instead of raising children (or working and letting others raise her children), and scraping along to get by. Love that strong should be celebrated, but few women are up to the challenge of shared misery.
Why does everything have to be so dramatic?
Is everyone blind to the notion that Nice-Rich Guys do exist or do you believe they are impossible to attain, or if they are rich, they can’t be nice, or if they are nice, they can’t possibly be rich? Just silly!
What happens when you see the whole package?
Do you ladies rationalize that if he is not interested in you, you didn’t really like him anyway, to assuage your bruised ego? LolzLolz!
Lw here,
Thanks for everyone’s advice. I broke up and moved out of my boyfriends house two days ago. It “literally” didn’t kill him.
Some of you guys were harsh… Which is I suppose deserved? Anyway, appreciate everyone that took the time to respond.
Good for you! Live your life as you please, with whom you please, and enjoy it – don’t settle 🙂
I wish like hell somebody had given me that advice when I was young; I wouldn’t have wasted so much time settling for “nice” guys who weren’t so nice after all (manipulative, controlling, etc.).
If you feel something is lacking-it is. Have Fun with rich guy because it shounds as if that’s what your happy doing. When you meet the “Right” one, you’ll feel it, you won’t ask not another living soul about him, you’ll feel it…