Updates: “Non-Christian” Responds
It’s time again for “Dear Wendy Updates,” a feature where people I’ve given advice to in the past let us know whether they followed the advice and how they’re doing now. Today we hear from “Non-Christian” who wondered if she should stop dating Christian men because it turned out, after six months of dating, that her ex (a pastor’s son) had qualms about having a long-term relationship with a non-Christian and he hadn’t been upfront about it from the beginning. I don’t want to discount all Christians because of this one experience,” she wrote, “but it was very painful for me when we broke up and I’d rather not repeat that experience again due to the same reason of religious differences.” Find out if she’s still dating Christian men or not in her update below (plus a bonus update from another LW).
Happy holidays to everyone!
Thank you for your update and happy holidays to you, too!
And now a bonus update from “Hung Up on Him” who was dating a guy who always hung up on her as soon as he “finished” during phone sex. Her update:
Well, considering that you were also LW2 in this column, where you wrote in about the guy who ghosted you for months, got back in touch, and then dropped a bombshell that he had a secret (fourth) child you didn’t know about, I’m gonna suggest you take a break from dating. In six months’ time you have dated three big losers who treat you like shit. You break this cycle by taking a break from dating, getting some therapy, and sorting your shit out. There is no “accident” about your finding assholes. You ARE looking for them, at least subconsciously, and at this point only a good therapist is going to help you figure out why and how to STOP looking for them.
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If you’re someone I’ve given advice to in the past, I’d love to hear from you, too. Email me at [email protected] with a link to the original post, and let me know whether you followed the advice and how you’re doing now.
I feel bad for LW2. All of her letters are batshit scenarios that no one in their right mind would put up with. That kind of low self-esteem has to be coming from a place of deep denial and lack of awareness that it takes a lot of self-work to tackle, and it doesn’t sound like she’s willing to do that.
If a bf tells you to shut the fuck up, and he’s not joking, you need to dump the motherfucker.
It’s sad that you accept behavior like that with hardly a second thought. Please, do as Wendy suggested. Stop dating. See a therapist. Figure out why you are attracted to and choose terrible men.
LW2: You don’t attract assholes, you don’t run the moment the show that they are assholes. Have some flipping self respect. If my husband told me to “shut the f up” I assume it would be followed by him running before I even opened my mouth (and I am in no way a violent person, just good sense on his part). You allow it so you receive it. Also, who isn’t super tired after an orgasm. As sexually liberated as I am phone sex just skeeves me out. I get that most don’t feel that way but I mean, what did you want, for him to cuddle the phone after? I don’t know you just need counseling all around. You have no respect for yourself.
LW#1 – good for you. Some people want to pretend they’re more tolerant than they actually are whether it be class, education, race, religion, geographical origin, whatever. I really don’t see this as an all encompassing Christian thing. I know so many successful couples who have different religious beliefs. You just keep looking for a good person who has similar guiding principles.
This. You aren’t attracting assholes LW; you’re not identifying asshole behavior and immediately walking away. You’re either giving them too much credit, making excuses for them or worst, thinking you don’t deserve better. You do.
I seriously think you need to stop dating for a bit and do a little self-reflection. Maybe get a book or two about healthy dating and healthy relationships.
Poop -I forgot I was replying – the second part is to LW#2. I need a nap
I got that, 🙂 Agree with the nap. Apparently the dogs thought I wanted to be up every hour last night. I DID NOT!
It’s not that she attracts asshole — she probably attracts a variety of men. I think Wendy is correct that she actively chooses the assholes. There is something about the asshole personality that intrigues her. Perhaps she views this bad behavior as an example of extreme confidence and wants a confident or strong man — like Trump’s core sees him as strong, while the rest of the country sees weakness and ineptitude. Therapy is a good suggestion. If she wants to stop suffering, she needs to find out why she finds assholes to be so appealing.
Eh i don’t know. I think she just doesn’t move on once they prove to be assholes. If I took every man I’ve ever so much as gone in a date with, 75% we’re easily assholes. The difference is I didn’t continue with said assholes. You can’t know if someone sucks without knowing them but allowing them in your life is a choice you make or not. I have a low tolerance, well for most anything but vodka, so I had no problem walking away when someone was a dick. LW says “wow that guy just told me to shut the f up, how do I solve this,” as opposed to “eat shit asshole” and walking away, which is what someone with self esteem and self worth would do b
I think it’s a combination of the two. A little “I can change him” plus “He’s interested therefore I am interested”
I bet that there are plenty of decent guys who are taking it a little more slowly trying to get to know the OP and the assholes are more brazen or more direct and so they get her attention quickly. And if I had to guess, she’s dismissing their asshole behavior because they show her interest and that has it’s own appeal.
OP – you deserve better. Demand better.
I think it’s a leap that she’s so desperate that she’s interested in the assholes simply because they are interested in her. She enjoys the asshole style. She enjoys it so much that she sticks with it for a long time after the assholery is obvious and she is being treated badly. It’s a difficult-to-change verity that we like what/who we like and that it’s very difficult to change that, no matter how self-destructive. Most people seem very reluctant to date against type and type gets established at an early age, very possibly long before we have our first date.
Why do we automatically say someone “deserves better.” Does she? Or, dows she kind of deserve as**oles at this point? I have no patience for people that see a pattern & dont actuveky try to change or grow.
I mean LOGICALLY you are attracting those people because you let them get away with it. Ppl like that love doormats like you because you make excuses for shitty behavior instead of walking away like a more sane person would do.
The one piece of advice would be to help weed out the jerks your attracting. Assume their behavior will never change. What they are doing is who they will be forever. If you aren’t willing to put up with what they are doing or how they treat you forever walk away. Honestly a lot of terrible people will start to disappear from your life.
Part of the solution is to learn to recognize over-the-top acts and phony personas from genuine interest by someone who likes you. Child molesters, pimps, abusers, married guys who are serial cheaters, con guys out for older women’s money: they all have learned how to put on a super-nice, super-attentive act to groom/trap their victim. Like fortune tellers and professional cons, they are very adept at quickly reading what you want, what you want to hear, what you want them to be. It’s an act, really it’s their profession. If they seem too good to be true, they are. It’s a shame that so many men know exactly what a woman wants, but choose to use that knowledge as a weapon.
I feel like this is why online dating is such a mess. A guy sends 200 profane messages and one woman bites. However, I do believe that all humans deserve to be respected. not knowing anything about her, she deserves better.
A lot of people don’t see these patterns, because they grew up with their parents in shitty relationships like this. A lot of people are brought up to be put everyone else first.
Some part of her has recognized this pattern, and that’s why she writes in. If you don’t have patience for people writing in with issues, maybe advice isn’t your thing?
Anonymous — you’ve described a possible reason for her dysfunctional romantic life, it may even be the correct reason, but what does that change. She has just abandoned one bad relationship and almost immediately jumped into the same bad relationship with a different guy. She needs to go on a dating hiatus and figure out and fix herself. Otherwise, she could get out of this bad relationship and the next one will be just the same. Therapy is the best answer. Yes, I agree she wrote in for some magic advice which will make her next relationship the right one which works out for her with a great guy. There is no such advice and no magic words. This is going to take some hard introspection on her part. Three bad dudes in a row. Wendy’s advice is spot on; there is no magic to be had here for this double repeat advice seeker. Therapy and a dating pause!
Ron, I was responding to bitterstraightgigi’s comment about patterns and changing. I don’t think she deserves assholes, as Gigi wrote. I said in my comment above she needs to go on a dating break and to see a therapist.
I bet LW2 is Carol.
LW2, the first time someone shows you they are an a**hole, you leave. Break up. Bye bye. Don’t stick around. The very first time. That is how you don’t end up with these guys. Start searching for kindness. I agree that some therapy sessions might help you figure things out.
LW1) you know what? STOP being openminded about Christians. Fuck them. No wait — DON’T. Never before had an entire religion been so fucking complicit in the just plain awfulness. AIM HIGHER.
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LW2. Take a break from dating. Regroup. Something is seriously off with you if you keep picking awful men like this… examine this in therapy. Fix it. Then try dating again.
BGM: There are Christians, and then there are CHRISTIANS. Christians are mostly okay; she would be well advised not to date any more CHRISTIANS. The tip off should have been the father who became a minister, post-retirement and then her bf joining the church. This sounds like it must be a fundamentalist church.
Eh. ALL are complicit. How many millions of children have been molested?
I think you must realize that the vast majority of Christians are not child molesters. I doubt there is much difference among various religious groupings, including the non-religious, in level of child molestation.
No. Complicit means they looked the other way for generations of abuse. Said nothing against racist, sexist, homophobic church teachings… so yeah. Christians remain dubious as fuck one and all.
BGM, when you say Christians, whom are you talking about? Are we talking Catholics, Evangelicals, mainline Protestants, or anyone who believes Jesus Christ was the savior?
Because I am hard pressed to lump in Unitarians with hardcore Catholics when it comes to their track record on sexual abuse , homophobia, and basically their stance on any social issue.
But, strictly speaking, they are both Christians.
Not limited to Christians. Within every fundamentalist sect there are abuses that go unchallenged because these people have been made demi-gods, not to be challenged by mere mortals. However, what we saw in the Catholic church was a systematic cover up in which the church was more important than it’s flock. Similar issues are coming out about the Mormons, Baptists and other Christian based religions with far reaching networks in which an abuser can be shipped off to be someone else’s problem. Smaller fundamentalist sects can’t do that – they can simply banish accusers stripping them of their entire lives. But yeah – not all Christians.
Uh, in addition to Christians, Mormons, Catholics, and Baptists… I would also avoid dating any members of fundalmentalist sects. Seek out the atheists and the agnostics if you truly revere human rights…
Mao was indeed a true human rights champion.
I wouldn’t say that agnostics or atheists are better examples. Mao and Stalin and others were dictators. They had a power structure in place in which they were demi-gods, like priests or pastors or others. Power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely is relevant whether or not you believe in a magical being.
Shit heads gonna be shit heads.
Whatever. Dimwitted Christians are ruining this fucking country. (Who else elected Trump?) Mao is dead and gone. Go pray to your imaginary friend. It’s such a fucking great use of time.
PS — you’ve named two. I could name thousands of Catholic Priests alone…
BGM – are you doing okay? You’ve been particularly…sharp, I guess I’d say…the last couple of days.
I am more than a little fed up lately. Just OVER everything as of late.
I’m sorry to here that. I hope you get to a place where shit feels less frustrating soon.
*hear
Thanks.
Ach, I’m sorry to hear that. Take care of yourself. I’m up for cross country musical creation whenever you’re ready.
Does your husband enjoy cocktails? You can’t go wrong with cool vintage or retro bar stuff…
Mark, what present are you getting yourself this year? Any recommendations for a frugal wife shopping for fourth?
I meant fourth year old husband.
Never mind, typing is hard.
Also struggling with some last minutes more affordable gifts for husband. Why are they so hard to shop for. I have a constant list in my mind. Ha.
I like the bar wear idea. Maybe some winter gear if you are in a colder area. I got my husband some nice gloves that have pads so you can use your phone with them on. I got him North Face ones which were about $45 so a little pricier but I wanted them to match the jacket I got him which that asshole shipper is scamming me on. Sigh. They make cheaper versions though. A nice shaving kit. Those one blade shavers that they advertise for like beards and such (but work for a lot of other things) have rave reviews from the men I know and are about $20.
My husband loves his coffee so I got him a special blend of a seasonal one he really likes.
Men, STOP BEING SO HARD TO SHOP FOR. My ex would only ever ask for cars (funny guy). He traveled a lot so I got him some Beats headphones and a Mophie case once. Never even freaking opened it. Ugh. No pleasing that guy.
Sorry BGM. Some self care perhaps. A massage, a day doing whatever you want without concerning yourself with others? A trip to Compton for some Bludsoe’s to fatten the belly?
LW2: I’ve had friends ask why they “attract” assholes. It’s not that you attract more than others, necessarily. It’s that other people see red flags and run the other way, but you don’t. You continue seeing them. So, for you, it becomes an actual relationship, whereas for another person, it would just be one date or one conversation (something that isn’t worth their energy to remember it happened). I don’t know if it’s that you don’t notice red flags (because you have a warped sense of what people are supposed to act like) or if you see them and ignore them, but you’ve got to stop blowing by red flags like they’re nothing. Dating isn’t that passive. You don’t just sit there and say, “Well, I guess I have to date this guy that showed up.” You have to actively look at the guy and the situation and decide if it’s going to turn out well. You can’t just be excited someone likes you and assume they must be a great person when you know nothing about them.
Keyblade: that last post was for you though it posted ABOVE yours somehow…